Pinnacle=Endeavor Air
06-07-2013, 04:03 PM
#264
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Nov 2006
Position: Body at sea level; heart at 70,000+
Posts: 1,349
Be careful everyone. The IRS, CIA, NSA, NSC, DOD, TSA, and a dozen other three letter agencies are probably reading everything we post. Doesn't it make you feel good that we are driving some low level civil servant monitors "out of their gourds" reading all this "intellectual discourse." They will eventually collect compensation for PTSD.
06-07-2013, 05:07 PM
#265
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Jan 2008
Posts: 1,341
As already stated, I have never landed flaps 0. No one would do that "just because." Obviously it has to be an abnormal/flaps fail situation to land at flaps 0. I don't know how it is now, but when I was at 9E, in the flaps 0 profile, the very last portion of the profile was at 60 kts "CA - I have control. FO - You have control. If FO landing" So that shows that it is ok in an abnormal situation for a FO to land at flaps 0, and not just a Captain-only landing. But again, I never landed flaps 0. Just make sure you know the profile before you bash someone for something they never did to begin with.
"fatal accidents as some sort of heinous barometer that says they are worse than someone else"
No, what I said was nearly all of those regional airlines cease to exist after a fatal passenger death crash. Regions/Corporate Air, Air Midwest, Colgan, Chalks Ocean Airways. There is no denying that after the Colgan crash, the Colgan name had to go. Ocean Chalk airways was the oldest airline among the regionals to be in service but once the fatal crash happened in 2005, that airline was done for and shut down. It's not a matter of being worse than someone else, it's just looking at past history to see what happens to regional airlines when they have a big fatal passenger crash. Either the name disappears/changes, or the airline itself ceases to exist. This *fact* should have been accounted for in "career expectations." But anyway, like you said, what's done is done and is all water under the bridge.
"fatal accidents as some sort of heinous barometer that says they are worse than someone else"
No, what I said was nearly all of those regional airlines cease to exist after a fatal passenger death crash. Regions/Corporate Air, Air Midwest, Colgan, Chalks Ocean Airways. There is no denying that after the Colgan crash, the Colgan name had to go. Ocean Chalk airways was the oldest airline among the regionals to be in service but once the fatal crash happened in 2005, that airline was done for and shut down. It's not a matter of being worse than someone else, it's just looking at past history to see what happens to regional airlines when they have a big fatal passenger crash. Either the name disappears/changes, or the airline itself ceases to exist. This *fact* should have been accounted for in "career expectations." But anyway, like you said, what's done is done and is all water under the bridge.
Next: if 0 flaps is not "CA only", which I will concede up to the point of, it's not specifically prohibited, why were we then not trained on it? If we aren't trained, what CA in their right mind allows a guy to do it? Can you imagine the fallout if a CA allows an FO prior to 2012 to 0 flap, FO goes off side, and media reveals no training whatsoever for 0 flap landings?
Finally: I acknowledge that you, ShyGuy, have not done a 0 flap landing. However, there is some tool bag, who used to work for Pinnacle, got a job at Virgin, and posted as "MA" on airlink, who wrote on a post there that he had 0 flap landed. Sorry I confused you with him. If you ever see him around the halls at Virgin America, ask why the heck he's so butthurt about a 3rd party arbitrated list at a company he doesn't work for any longer.
No hard feelings bro - sorry for thinking you were that loser!
06-07-2013, 06:09 PM
#266
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Dec 2005
Posts: 8,915
Hahaha that uniform changed. Notice the armpit area, there was no way to reach up to the overhead panel without eventually ripping the shirt. That changed with the new shirt. The epaulettes changed too, with no red and just a silver shinning/reflective surface on black background. The new uniform is much better than the one pictured.
06-07-2013, 06:15 PM
#267
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Dec 2005
Posts: 8,915
Next: if 0 flaps is not "CA only", which I will concede up to the point of, it's not specifically prohibited, why were we then not trained on it? If we aren't trained, what CA in their right mind allows a guy to do it? Can you imagine the fallout if a CA allows an FO prior to 2012 to 0 flap, FO goes off side, and media reveals no training whatsoever for 0 flap landings?
Finally: I acknowledge that you, ShyGuy, have not done a 0 flap landing. However, there is some tool bag, who used to work for Pinnacle, got a job at Virgin, and posted as "MA" on airlink, who wrote on a post there that he had 0 flap landed. Sorry I confused you with him. If you ever see him around the halls at Virgin America, ask why the heck he's so butthurt about a 3rd party arbitrated list at a company he doesn't work for any longer.
No hard feelings bro - sorry for thinking you were that loser!
No hard feelings bro - sorry for thinking you were that loser!
06-07-2013, 06:18 PM
#268
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: May 2013
Position: The Parlor
Posts: 1,247
I already posted about the accident Captain. Express I had the accident, and it did survive (that's why I didn't say all reigonals, but most).
Trained? It's a requirement for a type ride and that's why Captains do it. If it wasn't required, it wouldn't be done. So just because you haven't trained in the sim for a flaps 0, or a flaps 8, or a flaps 30 landing, means you can't do one? The media is going to fry you no matter what. They will say that the pilot didn't land the plane, a second backup pilot tried to land.
That guy never posted anything about a flaps zero landing, nor did he do a flaps 0 landing ever.
Trained? It's a requirement for a type ride and that's why Captains do it. If it wasn't required, it wouldn't be done. So just because you haven't trained in the sim for a flaps 0, or a flaps 8, or a flaps 30 landing, means you can't do one? The media is going to fry you no matter what. They will say that the pilot didn't land the plane, a second backup pilot tried to land.
That guy never posted anything about a flaps zero landing, nor did he do a flaps 0 landing ever.
