Stable wide-body fleet
04-12-2016, 01:15 PM
#31
:-)
Joined APC: Feb 2007
Posts: 7,339
International revenue is growing and the intent is to grow it to 40% of total revenue. My point is they plan to generate that revenue by selling seats on our subsidiaries/partners, excluding Delta pilots from the growth of the company. The JP Morgan audio is no longer available but the plan was clearly laid out. Pay attention to this stuff, they are telling wall street one thing and telling us another. Which do you think is more correct?
Here is how proud they are of not buying airplanes...
http://www.sec.gov/Archives/edgar/da.../image_012.jpg
Here is how proud they are of not buying airplanes...
http://www.sec.gov/Archives/edgar/da.../image_012.jpg
Honestly, your best bet is to demand WB pay on all Delta aircraft.
04-12-2016, 03:11 PM
#32
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Sep 2008
Position: "Prof" button manipulator
Posts: 1,685
I'll take my paycheck from a financially secure airline any day, thank you.
04-12-2016, 03:19 PM
#33
The Brown Dot +1
Joined APC: Jun 2009
Position: 777B
Posts: 7,775
All sarcasm aside, do you believe that EASKs are the bullet proof method of comparison? That it will be good forever and ever? There is so much anti DALPA propaganda on here about how incompetent they have been yet here they have somehow managed to negotiate the be all end all method of compensating us. I find that utterly fascinating. Or was this another lucky bounce like profit sharing?
Another fascinating thing about this particular argument is that many have said that Anderson played chess while ALPA played checkers. How many moves ahead have you thought? Or do we still have pieces to be "kinged"?
My contention is that the other side of the equation is going to be downsizing airframes. That reduces their ASKs. How do we recoup those losses?
Block hours are pilot positions. 1 DAL 757 = 1 AF 747/380
ASKs are airplane size dependent. In this case, smaller wins because it takes more of them to make up the seat deficit. Again, I will ask what you believe the replacement across the Atlantic for the 757 will be. If you believe it will be a smaller airframe, then your argument wins. Then I will ask what the eventual replacement for the 767 will be. Same result.
I know I am not going to change any minds, but at least you should be thinking about down the road. And if my position is insulting to some, as it appears to be, you need to lighten up. It is just a discussion.
Another fascinating thing about this particular argument is that many have said that Anderson played chess while ALPA played checkers. How many moves ahead have you thought? Or do we still have pieces to be "kinged"?
My contention is that the other side of the equation is going to be downsizing airframes. That reduces their ASKs. How do we recoup those losses?
Block hours are pilot positions. 1 DAL 757 = 1 AF 747/380
ASKs are airplane size dependent. In this case, smaller wins because it takes more of them to make up the seat deficit. Again, I will ask what you believe the replacement across the Atlantic for the 757 will be. If you believe it will be a smaller airframe, then your argument wins. Then I will ask what the eventual replacement for the 767 will be. Same result.
I know I am not going to change any minds, but at least you should be thinking about down the road. And if my position is insulting to some, as it appears to be, you need to lighten up. It is just a discussion.
When their widebody business plan includes me, I'll happily bend. Not until.
04-12-2016, 03:24 PM
#34
Da Hudge
Joined APC: Oct 2006
Position: Poodle Whisperer
Posts: 17,473
All sarcasm aside, do you believe that EASKs are the bullet proof method of comparison? That it will be good forever and ever? There is so much anti DALPA propaganda on here about how incompetent they have been yet here they have somehow managed to negotiate the be all end all method of compensating us. I find that utterly fascinating. Or was this another lucky bounce like profit sharing?
Another fascinating thing about this particular argument is that many have said that Anderson played chess while ALPA played checkers. How many moves ahead have you thought? Or do we still have pieces to be "kinged"?
My contention is that the other side of the equation is going to be downsizing airframes. That reduces their ASKs. How do we recoup those losses?
Block hours are pilot positions. 1 DAL 757 = 1 AF 747/380
ASKs are airplane size dependent. In this case, smaller wins because it takes more of them to make up the seat deficit. Again, I will ask what you believe the replacement across the Atlantic for the 757 will be. If you believe it will be a smaller airframe, then your argument wins. Then I will ask what the eventual replacement for the 767 will be. Same result.
I know I am not going to change any minds, but at least you should be thinking about down the road. And if my position is insulting to some, as it appears to be, you need to lighten up. It is just a discussion.
Another fascinating thing about this particular argument is that many have said that Anderson played chess while ALPA played checkers. How many moves ahead have you thought? Or do we still have pieces to be "kinged"?
My contention is that the other side of the equation is going to be downsizing airframes. That reduces their ASKs. How do we recoup those losses?
Block hours are pilot positions. 1 DAL 757 = 1 AF 747/380
ASKs are airplane size dependent. In this case, smaller wins because it takes more of them to make up the seat deficit. Again, I will ask what you believe the replacement across the Atlantic for the 757 will be. If you believe it will be a smaller airframe, then your argument wins. Then I will ask what the eventual replacement for the 767 will be. Same result.
I know I am not going to change any minds, but at least you should be thinking about down the road. And if my position is insulting to some, as it appears to be, you need to lighten up. It is just a discussion.
You'll almost certainly see A321NEOs crossing the Atlantic in Delta colors by the end of the decade. That has already been recognized as a real 757 replacement (and stated as such by RA).
04-12-2016, 03:29 PM
#35
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Oct 2009
Posts: 3,108
Sorry, couldn't pass that up.
04-12-2016, 03:37 PM
#36
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Sep 2008
Position: "Prof" button manipulator
Posts: 1,685
Delta will maintain a moderate ($5 Billion) debt load to thwart any Carl Icahn wannabe's from making that move. However, Delta remains invested in other areas to ensure easy access to a debt free balance sheet if the economy goes south.
American and United with their $25 Billion in debt, not so much. Like I said, I'll take a paycheck from a financially secure company vs. one who will drown in their debt in a matter of seconds, WHEN the economy turns south again.
04-12-2016, 05:11 PM
#37
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Jun 2015
Posts: 360
All sarcasm aside, do you believe that EASKs are the bullet proof method of comparison? That it will be good forever and ever? There is so much anti DALPA propaganda on here about how incompetent they have been yet here they have somehow managed to negotiate the be all end all method of compensating us. I find that utterly fascinating. Or was this another lucky bounce like profit sharing?
Another fascinating thing about this particular argument is that many have said that Anderson played chess while ALPA played checkers. How many moves ahead have you thought? Or do we still have pieces to be "kinged"?
My contention is that the other side of the equation is going to be downsizing airframes. That reduces their ASKs. How do we recoup those losses?
Block hours are pilot positions. 1 DAL 757 = 1 AF 747/380
ASKs are airplane size dependent. In this case, smaller wins because it takes more of them to make up the seat deficit. Again, I will ask what you believe the replacement across the Atlantic for the 757 will be. If you believe it will be a smaller airframe, then your argument wins. Then I will ask what the eventual replacement for the 767 will be. Same result.
I know I am not going to change any minds, but at least you should be thinking about down the road. And if my position is insulting to some, as it appears to be, you need to lighten up. It is just a discussion.
Another fascinating thing about this particular argument is that many have said that Anderson played chess while ALPA played checkers. How many moves ahead have you thought? Or do we still have pieces to be "kinged"?
My contention is that the other side of the equation is going to be downsizing airframes. That reduces their ASKs. How do we recoup those losses?
Block hours are pilot positions. 1 DAL 757 = 1 AF 747/380
ASKs are airplane size dependent. In this case, smaller wins because it takes more of them to make up the seat deficit. Again, I will ask what you believe the replacement across the Atlantic for the 757 will be. If you believe it will be a smaller airframe, then your argument wins. Then I will ask what the eventual replacement for the 767 will be. Same result.
I know I am not going to change any minds, but at least you should be thinking about down the road. And if my position is insulting to some, as it appears to be, you need to lighten up. It is just a discussion.
I don't think EASK comparisons are bullet proof and good for ever and ever. But they are undoubtedly better than BH metrics for the purposes of our debate. As for the compensation that resulted from the EASK metric, I submit the JV grievance settlement...
Thinking long term, I'm not sure any timeframe longer than the next CEO is even worth wasting brain cells on when considering the "chess moves" you're talking about. With the current management team and CEO and their widebody plan, the EASK metric seems to be a better move.
Your comment about recouping losses implies that DAL would have to pull down flying if EASKs shrink at AF/KLM - that's not how I read the contract. We can be above the production balance without penalty.
Lastly, your comments about block hours relating to pilot jobs and ASKs being a/c size dependent actually support the argument for EASK instead of BH, particularly given DAL's tendency to down gauge.
04-12-2016, 05:47 PM
#38
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Jul 2007
Position: 73
Posts: 225
Just a dumb question here, since we are talking big planes, seat miles, etc.
Why are there always Qantas A380s and a 747 or two parked on the remote ramps in LAX. It looks like they cross the Pacific and hang out for lots and lots of hours (can't make money sitting out there). Is there maintenance being done?
I see our 777 turn right away in SYD, get back to LAX and bomb off somewhere else. The Qantas, and other airline's 380s arrive, get towed to the beach ramp and sit all day.
Riddle me that one smart people.
Humboldt
Why are there always Qantas A380s and a 747 or two parked on the remote ramps in LAX. It looks like they cross the Pacific and hang out for lots and lots of hours (can't make money sitting out there). Is there maintenance being done?
I see our 777 turn right away in SYD, get back to LAX and bomb off somewhere else. The Qantas, and other airline's 380s arrive, get towed to the beach ramp and sit all day.
Riddle me that one smart people.
Humboldt
Last edited by Humboldt; 04-12-2016 at 05:49 PM. Reason: scared of grammar police
04-12-2016, 06:18 PM
#39
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Jun 2015
Posts: 360
Just a dumb question here, since we are talking big planes, seat miles, etc.
Why are there always Qantas A380s and a 747 or two parked on the remote ramps in LAX. It looks like they cross the Pacific and hang out for lots and lots of hours (can't make money sitting out there). Is there maintenance being done?
I see our 777 turn right away in SYD, get back to LAX and bomb off somewhere else. The Qantas, and other airline's 380s arrive, get towed to the beach ramp and sit all day.
Riddle me that one smart people.
Humboldt
Why are there always Qantas A380s and a 747 or two parked on the remote ramps in LAX. It looks like they cross the Pacific and hang out for lots and lots of hours (can't make money sitting out there). Is there maintenance being done?
I see our 777 turn right away in SYD, get back to LAX and bomb off somewhere else. The Qantas, and other airline's 380s arrive, get towed to the beach ramp and sit all day.
Riddle me that one smart people.
Humboldt
But maybe you can answer this question for me since it's a little bit closer to home. How come Virgin Australia has double the frequency between the U.S. and Australia compared to DAL?
04-12-2016, 07:48 PM
#40
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Apr 2014
Posts: 367
Ok, making an attempt at reading. According to Fidelity AAL and DAL each have $42bln in liabilities. I'm leaving the assets out of the picture (DAL is better off by $5bln) however I fail to see a 1:5 ratio. If I were a new pilot AAL is a no brainier, more basing options as well. Unfortunately too old to leap over.
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