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Old 04-15-2015, 09:46 PM
  #3701  
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Originally Posted by bohicagain
That's right also trips will tend to be less commutable. I am all for 6 hour but not a 6ADG, but a hard 6 hour min per day. I would love to work 13-14 days a month for 78-84 hours of pay.
Less pilots & less commutable = QOL suck for many. The company would love it.......we, however...
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Old 04-16-2015, 02:48 AM
  #3702  
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Originally Posted by dtfl
Less pilots & less commutable = QOL suck for many. The company would love it.......we, however...
If they could build trips to 6 hours per day now hard time, they would do it. Going to a higher number most likely will only add more credit driving up pilot requirements. The downside is that in an attempt to reduce the additional credit, it will definitely affect rotation construction.
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Old 04-16-2015, 04:23 AM
  #3703  
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I think it's the 737 that skews all the credit numbers, or at least it used to. Perhaps with all the new jets coming they can schedule something more than 3 legs in 4 days, and less 24 hour layovers.
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Old 04-16-2015, 04:24 AM
  #3704  
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Originally Posted by Timbo
"More Productive" also means less pilots required.

If everyone is flying 6+ hours per day instead of 5:15, they won't need as many pilots to cover all the flying.

Be careful what you ask for.
What?

Six hours a day just means you fill up in 2 fewer days/month; no reduction in pilot requirements. Probably would increase the reserves required for narrowbody guys as more trips would push the limits on 117 rules.

I do agree with the fact commutable trips would mostly disappear, especially for us narrowbody guys.

Omar
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Old 04-16-2015, 05:55 AM
  #3705  
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Originally Posted by Timbo
"More Productive" also means less pilots required.

If everyone is flying 6+ hours per day instead of 5:15, they won't need as many pilots to cover all the flying.

Be careful what you ask for.
There's that too.
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Old 04-16-2015, 07:11 AM
  #3706  
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Originally Posted by dtfl
Less pilots & less commutable = QOL suck for many. The company would love it.......we, however...
Originally Posted by Timbo
"More Productive" also means less pilots required.

If everyone is flying 6+ hours per day instead of 5:15, they won't need as many pilots to cover all the flying.

Be careful what you ask for.
disagree with both of you only loss of pilot jobs would be if we also raised alv and tlv, higher daily credit might mean less commutable tho
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Old 04-16-2015, 07:15 AM
  #3707  
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Originally Posted by pilotjockey
disagree with both of you only loss of pilot jobs would be if we also raised alv and tlv, higher daily credit might mean less commutable tho
It is possible, but not a guarantee, that pilot jobs would be lost. If aircraft utilization rates went up due to 6/day guarantee, it could be a wash (pilot head count wise) and good for profit sharing. However, I tend to think that if they could have higher utilization rates domestically, they'd already be doing that...So, pilot jobs could be lost.
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Old 04-16-2015, 08:06 AM
  #3708  
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Originally Posted by Check Essential
Regarding what happened with C2012, I will quote Hillary. "At this point, what difference does it make?".

My only objective in posting about this is to urge caution and hope the reps keep the administration on a much shorter leash this time or the same thing could happen again. The reps could wake up one morning and read in the paper that the Delta pilots have a new contract.
Voting it down or sending it back for modifications is far more difficult after those headlines have run.
That's the lesson of C2012. Sorry if that offends some people.
What you are saying above is not offensive, what I found offensive is attacking your fellow pilots credibility simply because they don't have the same opinion as you do. You also mischaracterized what I was saying. (emphasis added)

Originally Posted by Falcon7
I'm not spinning Carl, because I'm not asserting everything was done exactly by the book, nor am I asserting that it wasn't. IOW I'm not joining Karnak, nor am I buying your assertion of proof just because you say so.
Healthy skepticism is good, but that cuts both ways. One of the lessons of C2012, IMO, is to also be skeptical of the skeptics.
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Old 04-16-2015, 09:05 AM
  #3709  
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Originally Posted by Omar 111
What?

Six hours a day just means you fill up in 2 fewer days/month; no reduction in pilot requirements. Probably would increase the reserves required for narrowbody guys as more trips would push the limits on 117 rules.

I do agree with the fact commutable trips would mostly disappear, especially for us narrowbody guys.

Omar
As others have pointed out, it depends on how much of that 6 hours per day is credit vs. hard time. Nobody likes sitting around the pilot lounge for 3 hours waiting on their next flight, but that type of a trip creates more credit. More credit = more pilots required.

If every domestic flew 6hours block time every day...and the company was able to eliminate all that sitting around/credit time, well, they'd need fewer pilots.

Luckily, they haven't figured out how to do it yet.
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Old 04-16-2015, 11:23 AM
  #3710  
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Originally Posted by Falcon7
Healthy skepticism is good, but that cuts both ways. One of the lessons of C2012, IMO, is to also be skeptical of the skeptics.
When it comes to our compensation package--the very food on our tables--I would hope everyone is proactive, engaged, and "skeptical;" especially after "our" "union" served us a load of horse**** on C12.

Frankly, I don't know why anyone would blindly trust an organization that has proven time and again its interests are not necessarily aligned with the Delta pilots' interests.

When it comes to DALPA's performance, transparency, and accountability...I'm skeptical of anyone who's not skeptical of them.
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