Falcon7

Variable, or at risk, it's about how much Delta pilots are compensated at the end of the day, right?

gzsg

Management does a great job of attempting to make profit sharing part of our pay, when in reality it is just another piece of our contract. Just like vacation or medical or trip rig.

All of the sudden we have something that benefits the pilots and they want to reduce it.

I am perfectly willing to give up profit sharing. "Pay" in exchange for a 60% FAE defined benefit retirement, a 75 hour hard cap and a return to paper line bidding with 7 weeks of trips touching vacation.

Whoa! Managment doesn't want to talk about those items.

Letting them cherry pick our PWA to self fund is not only unacceptable, it is reprehensible.

sailingfun

Wow, 7 weeks of trips touching vacations. With 12 day trips and month overlap vacations I could convert that into 12 months off a year. Love the way you think!

Purple Drank

You mock that idea...yet you have no problem with management proposing something that will be as negative for pilots as Jerry's proposal is positive.

Why is that? Whose side are you on?

GogglesPisano

From what I've heard, the only people wanting to diminish our PS are DALPA.

gzsg

I you would stop thinking of yourself for a second, you would see that I was making the point that PS is not pay. Management does not get to gut our PWA of the last few good things we have.

Back to you Sailing. You are amazing and super smart. Better than all Delta pilots.

Falcon7

It is "just another piece of our contract." It happens to be in Section 3 Compensation, so it's important to me because it ultimately affects how much I'm paid.

If they are trying to reduce it, because it's costing them serious money now, would that really be a "sudden" surprise to anyone?

So you are "perfectly willing" to trade PS. I didn't think you would be, but sorry you can count me as one who would not trade profit sharing for another DB promise. I'd rather they just pay me, I'll make the determination of where I'll put the money.

Reprehensible, or expected? Do any of us really believe that they would show up without a list? We have ours, they have theirs, why does that seem like a surprise, or "reprehensible" and not just a part of the negotiating process? I try to keep the emotion out of it.

sailingfun

Jerry's proposal would give some pilots the ability to take the entire year off. You are saying management has proposed something as negative as that is positive? What did they open for, no vacation at all? I suspect you will find that management opened for little or no change in the vacation section.
I would also be willing once again to make a bet with you that the final contract improves our vacation.

TheManager

This is easy.

Here is what I propose. A two plan compensation system. So, much like we have different medical benefits we can chose, move to a compensation structure where the individual pilot makes the choice which package they would like to take.

Plan A:

Profit sharing intact at current % rates along with a whatever negotiated rate comes out in the contract.

Plan B:

Profit sharing eliminated for a commensurate addition to the pay rates as to be determined by the skillful ALPA negotiators.

Include the caveat that once an individual decides to transition from plan A to plan B, they are ineligible to then transition back to plan A on the next contract cycle.

The company would insist on that above caveat as they would like to see the PS plan eliminated completely. New hires after the signing date would only be eligible for plan b.

How hard was that, Tool? I know, I know, hang with me here, LOL! So simple even you clean figure out how to check one of two boxes


Being that you have not realized that there has been a ground shaking, industry transforming event that took place, oh about... 8 years ago now, I'm positive you'd sign up for plan B.

Then as you commit fiscal seppuku to your family budget and retirement, you and your ALPA acolytes won't take us all down with you on your miscalculated and logically suspect scheme.

OldFlyGuy

AA banded the the a330 with the 777 rates. Our 764 and 330 would be in the 777 band at either AA or UAL...which would benefit me. The other AA rates look about 7% higher with no pro shar and crap rigs. Overall, I think we'd reject AA's contract outright and stick with ours. There is clearly a lot of Forum disagreement on ProShar: to monetize all/some/or none. Contract surveys were probably split as well. DAL has made the PS a big part of our corp culture, so I don't see them messing with it much. OFG