Details on Delta TA
08-30-2014, 04:57 PM
#1171
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Feb 2014
Posts: 463
A day one redeye at leasts gives the pilot time to adjust his schedule to get sufficient rest. I used to do the redeyes all the time - I did adjust my body clock (no kids at home) to go to sleep @ 3 AM PST and we generally got to the hotel @ 7 AM EST so I was only a couple of hours late to bed. On day 3 (after 30 hour layover) we were back to LAX by 9 PM PST and I was home by midnight ready to get back in bed @ 3 AM PST. I much preferred the one year when I was senior because they were still manning LAX and had 4 day (all day flying) trips that paid 22-24 hours and I only worked 3 trips (12 days) a month. That meant being on a different sleep schedule because I had to be up by 5:30 AM to make my commute in on Day 1. CDOs do not offer any flexibility to the pilot.
1. On average, a human being needs 8 uninterrupted hours of actual sleep per day. Some individuals, due to their body mechanics, hormones, etc require closer to 9. Some can get by with slightly less than 8. On average, 8 is the number. This amount of time excludes the time to get ready for bed, calm the mind from the days activities and shut down.
2. The time of day of the sleep is not as important as the fact it is consistent. Shift workers pulling nights do OK as long as they work and sleep the same time every day. One caveat, if sleeping during the day it is important to make the room quiet and pitch black as possible. Daylight (5000 plus Kelvin on the color chart or higher) or Tungsten light (3200 K...most household lighting) immediately shuts down melatonin production, an important element of the restorative sleep cycle.
With these in mind, and trying to forget how the 117 fatigue rules were hijacked by powerful lobbyists and a weak, overly agreeable union, we should now be working at Delta Air Lines to improve safety by "scheduling with safety". This will improve health and safety. It might reduce corporate profits by 1% but if the company and the union are serious about safety (SD always talks about it being the number one priority and the union says it is committed to safety) then we should work to fashion trips that implement these two important rules to restorative sleep above. Again, 8 hours of continuous sleep the same time each day of a trip where possible. Also, hotels need to be construction free, quiet and able to shut down all light in the room.
How about some constructive engagement outside of contract negotiations to do the right thing because it promotes safety and safety isn't just words we use to hide behind if something goes wrong?
One other thing, let's not use the fact that some ops (ie international flying) will be harder (but not impossible) to improve as an excuse to not address any and all flying that can be. Further, lets never use the fact that some operations currently break the rules of fatigue mitigation to justify adding more.
08-30-2014, 05:42 PM
#1172
Back on TDY
Joined APC: Apr 2008
Position: 747-400 Captain
Posts: 12,487
When you distill down the hundreds of sleep studies there emerges some baseline requirements to be adequately rested to perform duties of a technical or safety related nature:
1. On average, a human being needs 8 uninterrupted hours of actual sleep per day. Some individuals, due to their body mechanics, hormones, etc require closer to 9. Some can get by with slightly less than 8. On average, 8 is the number. This amount of time excludes the time to get ready for bed, calm the mind from the days activities and shut down.
2. The time of day of the sleep is not as important as the fact it is consistent. Shift workers pulling nights do OK as long as they work and sleep the same time every day. One caveat, if sleeping during the day it is important to make the room quiet and pitch black as possible. Daylight (5000 plus Kelvin on the color chart or higher) or Tungsten light (3200 K...most household lighting) immediately shuts down melatonin production, an important element of the restorative sleep cycle.
With these in mind, and trying to forget how the 117 fatigue rules were hijacked by powerful lobbyists and a weak, overly agreeable union, we should now be working at Delta Air Lines to improve safety by "scheduling with safety". This will improve health and safety. It might reduce corporate profits by 1% but if the company and the union are serious about safety (SD always talks about it being the number one priority and the union says it is committed to safety) then we should work to fashion trips that implement these two important rules to restorative sleep above. Again, 8 hours of continuous sleep the same time each day of a trip where possible. Also, hotels need to be construction free, quiet and able to shut down all light in the room.
How about some constructive engagement outside of contract negotiations to do the right thing because it promotes safety and safety isn't just words we use to hide behind if something goes wrong?
One other thing, let's not use the fact that some ops (ie international flying) will be harder (but not impossible) to improve as an excuse to not address any and all flying that can be. Further, lets never use the fact that some operations currently break the rules of fatigue mitigation to justify adding more.
1. On average, a human being needs 8 uninterrupted hours of actual sleep per day. Some individuals, due to their body mechanics, hormones, etc require closer to 9. Some can get by with slightly less than 8. On average, 8 is the number. This amount of time excludes the time to get ready for bed, calm the mind from the days activities and shut down.
2. The time of day of the sleep is not as important as the fact it is consistent. Shift workers pulling nights do OK as long as they work and sleep the same time every day. One caveat, if sleeping during the day it is important to make the room quiet and pitch black as possible. Daylight (5000 plus Kelvin on the color chart or higher) or Tungsten light (3200 K...most household lighting) immediately shuts down melatonin production, an important element of the restorative sleep cycle.
With these in mind, and trying to forget how the 117 fatigue rules were hijacked by powerful lobbyists and a weak, overly agreeable union, we should now be working at Delta Air Lines to improve safety by "scheduling with safety". This will improve health and safety. It might reduce corporate profits by 1% but if the company and the union are serious about safety (SD always talks about it being the number one priority and the union says it is committed to safety) then we should work to fashion trips that implement these two important rules to restorative sleep above. Again, 8 hours of continuous sleep the same time each day of a trip where possible. Also, hotels need to be construction free, quiet and able to shut down all light in the room.
How about some constructive engagement outside of contract negotiations to do the right thing because it promotes safety and safety isn't just words we use to hide behind if something goes wrong?
One other thing, let's not use the fact that some ops (ie international flying) will be harder (but not impossible) to improve as an excuse to not address any and all flying that can be. Further, lets never use the fact that some operations currently break the rules of fatigue mitigation to justify adding more.
Carl
08-30-2014, 06:12 PM
#1173
Straight QOL, homie
Joined APC: Feb 2012
Position: Record-Shattering Profit Facilitator
Posts: 4,202
From a management trainee's indoc FAQs:
Q. How can we publicly appear to be safe, while not spending the money to be truly safe?
A.
1) Talk a good game;
2) Hire pilots who are going to "man up" to "complete the mission" (see also: rocking chair);
3) Work hard to manipulate/co-opt ALPA to ensure it isn't going to "man up;" all which all lead to:
4) Cash bonus checks
Q. How can we publicly appear to be safe, while not spending the money to be truly safe?
A.
1) Talk a good game;
2) Hire pilots who are going to "man up" to "complete the mission" (see also: rocking chair);
3) Work hard to manipulate/co-opt ALPA to ensure it isn't going to "man up;" all which all lead to:
4) Cash bonus checks
08-30-2014, 06:32 PM
#1176
:-)
Joined APC: Feb 2007
Posts: 7,339
Yes, for health, but optimal cognitive function is 7.
Every neuroscience study has shown this similar result. The largest human cognitive performance dataset reveals insights into the effects of lifestyle factors and aging
Every neuroscience study has shown this similar result. The largest human cognitive performance dataset reveals insights into the effects of lifestyle factors and aging
08-30-2014, 06:53 PM
#1177
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Feb 2014
Posts: 463
Yes, for health, but optimal cognitive function is 7.
Every neuroscience study has shown this similar result. The largest human cognitive performance dataset reveals insights into the effects of lifestyle factors and aging
Every neuroscience study has shown this similar result. The largest human cognitive performance dataset reveals insights into the effects of lifestyle factors and aging
08-30-2014, 07:08 PM
#1178
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Feb 2014
Posts: 463
As 80 mentioned, no two humans are alike. Pilot are pressurized/depressurized with each flight, bombarded with radiation that passes through the skin of the airplane and UV light that comes directly through the front windshield for more time than is healthy (a little bit of sunlight is healthy...too much is damaging).
Pilots sometimes go from extreme heat to extreme cold, develop poor circulation (especially in the legs) from sitting too much, do not typically get adequate nutrition due to tight schedules or food not being readily available....or eating junk food to fill the void.
Other factors, include higher stress levels going into unfamiliar locations, dealing with WX/unruly pax and experience increased heart rate/stress during the take off and landing phase of flight which all hammer away at the bodies healthy function. Common sense says pilots should get more restorative sleep than the suggested guidelines to make up for these things that deplete/break down the human body and cause increase physical/mental fatigue.
Let me add one other item that affects the quality of sleep. It's a complete crap shoot knowing what the bed you will be sleeping in is like. The sleep studies I have seen always used the same controlled environment. Pilots don't know if the room will have a pillow that crank your neck to 45 degrees, a hard/medium/soft bed that breaths or makes you sweat, air conditioning system you can't get dialed in the same as back home. Needless to say, many things working against the standard here.
Pilots sometimes go from extreme heat to extreme cold, develop poor circulation (especially in the legs) from sitting too much, do not typically get adequate nutrition due to tight schedules or food not being readily available....or eating junk food to fill the void.
Other factors, include higher stress levels going into unfamiliar locations, dealing with WX/unruly pax and experience increased heart rate/stress during the take off and landing phase of flight which all hammer away at the bodies healthy function. Common sense says pilots should get more restorative sleep than the suggested guidelines to make up for these things that deplete/break down the human body and cause increase physical/mental fatigue.
Let me add one other item that affects the quality of sleep. It's a complete crap shoot knowing what the bed you will be sleeping in is like. The sleep studies I have seen always used the same controlled environment. Pilots don't know if the room will have a pillow that crank your neck to 45 degrees, a hard/medium/soft bed that breaths or makes you sweat, air conditioning system you can't get dialed in the same as back home. Needless to say, many things working against the standard here.
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