Any "Latest & Greatest" about Delta?
03-01-2012, 12:04 PM
Happy to be here
Joined APC: Jun 2006
Position: A-320A
Posts: 18,563
It depends on what this pilot group wants, but as with everything, there are unintended consequences for every action. We are currently not seeing those jets because it is cheaper for us to operate the 767-300ER's across the pond and AF operate the large metal. Banding may allow larger jets to be placed at DAL, but one must weigh the pros and cons of banding in both cases, then vote on it.
03-01-2012, 12:05 PM
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Sep 2010
Posts: 248
It's a fantastic day here in West Tennessee. I'm going out to the deer lease to see the new old tractor we got to manage the land. Two Delta pilots managed to break the old W. German John Deere last season. Luckily, we have four retired mechanics in the lease. I had my "hair shirt" on earlier this morning. I value each of you as my peers and the efforts you make each day on behalf of Delta Air Lines. I stand by my comments and appreciate the discourse. We are at a watershed. Frustration is building to a fever pitch. We can use that to change the course of our careers, or we can Red Book/Green Book, Delta/Western/PanAm ourselves into the mediocre middle of the pack. I was hired at Western, got the green light at Delta, went to Northwest and flew on the Red side, spent the last 23 years in a Green base and had a relative that flew for PanAm. They are or were all among the best this profession has offered. Unity.
Good timing for this. Great post
03-01-2012, 12:07 PM
The Brown Dot +1
Joined APC: Jun 2009
Position: 777B
Posts: 7,775
So if I understand your logic correctly, should the 747 pay the same as the 767 (widebody band) and the 757 should pay what the dc-9 pays, or is there some upside in pay banding aside from saving training costs?
03-01-2012, 12:10 PM
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Feb 2007
Position: 765-A
Posts: 6,844
I know I've used this analogy before, but you have to remember we had two "parents". Dad (senior management) was an SOB, slapped us around just because he could and always had his hand in our pockets. Mom (flight ops) was a real nice lady. Always on the lookout for good "stuff" that we needed and always wanted us to be the best behaved (trained).
We tried for an industry leading contract in '97, even struck over it. Did we get it? I would say no. We got a raise, but with our version of AVL it was a wash at best. You guys jumped that with C2k, good on ya.
Everything else you said I agree with.
Ferd
We tried for an industry leading contract in '97, even struck over it. Did we get it? I would say no. We got a raise, but with our version of AVL it was a wash at best. You guys jumped that with C2k, good on ya.
Everything else you said I agree with.
Ferd
Didn't we did get a pay raise post 9/11 that put us up near the top, if not at the top of the industry for a while?
03-01-2012, 12:10 PM
Happy to be here
Joined APC: Jun 2006
Position: A-320A
Posts: 18,563
If you can fill them, and we can, they have the lowest CASM in our fleet. This is followed by the 753.
03-01-2012, 12:20 PM
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Apr 2008
Position: LAX ERA
Posts: 3,457
Ferd
03-01-2012, 12:22 PM
Happy to be here
Joined APC: Jun 2006
Position: A-320A
Posts: 18,563
In other news the ComAir CEO stepped down as well.
03-01-2012, 12:23 PM
Moderator
Joined APC: Oct 2006
Position: B757/767
Posts: 13,088
What the company wants is pay banding. It could be a good thing on narrow body jets, but on the 744, as soon as we agreed to band it with say the 330,765,and ER I bet we would see the 773 or 748i.
It depends on what this pilot group wants, but as with everything, there are unintended consequences for every action. We are currently not seeing those jets because it is cheaper for us to operate the 767-300ER's across the pond and AF operate the large metal. Banding may allow larger jets to be placed at DAL, but one must weigh the pros and cons of banding in both cases, then vote on it.
It depends on what this pilot group wants, but as with everything, there are unintended consequences for every action. We are currently not seeing those jets because it is cheaper for us to operate the 767-300ER's across the pond and AF operate the large metal. Banding may allow larger jets to be placed at DAL, but one must weigh the pros and cons of banding in both cases, then vote on it.
03-01-2012, 12:35 PM
No longer cares
Joined APC: Mar 2008
Position: 767er Captain
Posts: 12,109
The 747/777/330/765 make up 12% of the fleet.. period. Management's decision to buy those airplanes, or NOT buy those airplanes, which they aren't... and you have been here long enough to know that they ain't gonna buy any more 747s. What airplane has management bought lately? 737-900. A replacement to the 757 and 767. Will it pay as much as the aircraft they are replacing? I'll let you decide for yourself on that one. Personally, I doubt it.. So we.. once again.. take pay cut based on a management decision. Why do we handcuff ourselves to that contract after contract? I would prefer longevity based pay based on how long you have been here, but that is too hard a sell, so I concede to banding because it gives some guys a little comfort with the whole productivity thing.. (that is a myth, because yet again.. WE do not buy airplanes, management does.) Oh, I would leave the 757 in the widebody band, but since they are going away, it really wouldn't matter...
What I would LOVE is for somebody to convince me that productivity is a valid reason for staying away from banded pay. However, that logic cannot say anything about faster more people more cargo, because as I said before, management makes the purchasing decisions. It would be up to us to make us expensive enough so that they would want economy of scale. Bottom line for me is.. I push throttles. Pay me for doing so. While I love the 76, I don't really care what the airplane is as long as I am getting paid to fly it.
03-01-2012, 12:42 PM
Happy to be here
Joined APC: Jun 2006
Position: A-320A
Posts: 18,563
It may mean more jobs, but they may pay significantly less. Banding may also create more jobs, but at a lower pay rate than the 777/744 would get alone. It is not just quantity but quality. RJ's and their pay rates have proven that.
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