Originally Posted by TheManager

SWEET! So we will see DALPA open with 8% and perhaps settle into that 3-5% range. We win!! Thanks for the nice pin though.

Originally Posted by get there itis

It's not 60 new frames. We're retiring some A320's & some domestic 767's too. I believe it's 85 retirements so 15 additional frames. I'm guessing the A320's on operating leases are the ones to go.

Originally Posted by sailingfun

The two contracts were carefully compared by both committees. The average total hours paid under each contract during the 3 years prior to the merger were within .5 hours of each other with the Delta contract slightly higher. You can ask the people involved at NW for the exact numbers Carl.
Yes NW had some aspects that produced increases Delta did not have. However Delta had a bunch of aspects to their contract NW did not have. Examples include a higher reserve guarantee for NW. However that was offset by reroute pay, reserve duty period lookback, additional pay for long call trips under 12 hours, pay on top of the guarantee for GS flying ect..
NW got limited pay above 80 hours at time and a half however it was not as posted often on all flying. There was a system that for practical purposes limited the hours depending on the caps. Delta paid double pay on all GS flying. In the end when everything was added up each contract produced essentially the same pay hours per month per pilot.
The Delta 1113 contract was however much shorter duration then the NW contract with higher rates. The much shorter duration of the Delta contract was a critical item. Carl claims he made more as a NW pilot but the facts don't support his case.
Premerger the NW pay rate on the 757 as a example was 142 dollars an hour. There were some small raise built into the NW contract so the rate today would be around 148 to 150. I don't have the exact numbers. The rate in effect today with the joint contract is 189 an hour or over 25 percent higher.
Carl was getting 177 an hour at the merger as a 747 Captain. He currently with international pay is getting 231.75 an hour. He is also getting a additional 1 percent a hour into retirement which will jump to 14 percent in 11 months or an additional 32 dollars an hour if Carl was a 0 percenter in the NW matrix. That would bring his total raise on 1 Jan 13 to 87 dollars an hour. With the raises in the NW contract he will still be 80 dollars an hour ahead.

Originally Posted by Wingnutdal

What was the spin on that? I swear that the more you DPA guys come on here with your ****y attitudes the more people you're going to lose.

I think that our pilot group in general has no idea how a section 6 works, what it involves, the time it takes, and the actual chances of being released. But you guys keep talking tough, you know more than anyone else, and can get everything all 12,000 pilots want.

God D@&$(&@!

Originally Posted by TheManager

Well nut, maybe I should hang out here more then. I'm going to let you in on a secret! Shhhh. Don't tell anyone, o. k.? Not a DPA member, really.

And go take a baby asprin before you stroke out. It's a forum genius.

Originally Posted by Sink r8

Of course, it's also a question of timing. If the retirements occur faster, then we shrink for a while. If they occur slower than deliveries, we grow for a while, until we roll into another period of deliveries and retirements. So even the 15 number can feel like 0, just as much as it can feel like 50, at any given time.

Originally Posted by Free Bird

Many folks that I fly with believe that we left some low hanging fruit on the tree with LOA 19 and the Joint contract. Yes, the merger would of happened anyways, we all realize that. What would not of happened however is the mess that is our scope clause. Correct me if I'm wrong, but I believe the 255 70 seat RJ's would not of been allowed under our previous PWA. The Alaska codeshare would not of been allowed. No?

Other folks think that for our cooperation and sacrifices we should of gotten more pay up front. I can't argue with that either. Our leverage, was that they needed us to get this merger done right (scope, codeshare allowances) and we gave those allowances for minimal pay increases and we still allowed more outsourcing.

Looking to the future most guys want job protections in regard to the JV's and codeshare. Not a repeat of a contract with minimal pay increases only to see more flying outsourced.

Originally Posted by Bill Lumberg

If a weak TA is even offered by ALPA, they are mostly likely GONE, and Slowplay and other MEC members KNOW IT.

Originally Posted by DAL 88 Driver

Please show your math on that.