Any "Latest & Greatest" about Delta?
12-21-2011, 01:19 PM
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I wonder why that hasn't been the case at Delta then already? We have had much tighter duty days etc than the FAR's and many other carriers.. Yet we haven't been forced to change. (just making the point that it is not an absolute)
The other thing to look at when it comes to flight time, it is a HARD time. That means if you have yet to take off and you are now projected to go over due to a long taxi time, you must go back to the gate. As it stands now the company can schedule for 7:59 and have no fear if it goes over. If they push it that close now say on a SXM turn and you go over 2 minutes, you can not take off for the return flight. Same with a 2 man crew that "may" be legal to go to Europe blocked at 8:45.. 15 minute delay in JFK and they are toast. Is it worth the risk to try this with a two man crew?
Not saying that a company wont try anything, but my guess is there will have to be a heavy buffer between scheduled and what is legal or they will run a huge risk of getting planes stuck in places they do not want them, or a lot of gate returns. Doesn't take to many xled flights to make up for the cost of a third pilot.
The other thing to look at when it comes to flight time, it is a HARD time. That means if you have yet to take off and you are now projected to go over due to a long taxi time, you must go back to the gate. As it stands now the company can schedule for 7:59 and have no fear if it goes over. If they push it that close now say on a SXM turn and you go over 2 minutes, you can not take off for the return flight. Same with a 2 man crew that "may" be legal to go to Europe blocked at 8:45.. 15 minute delay in JFK and they are toast. Is it worth the risk to try this with a two man crew?
Not saying that a company wont try anything, but my guess is there will have to be a heavy buffer between scheduled and what is legal or they will run a huge risk of getting planes stuck in places they do not want them, or a lot of gate returns. Doesn't take to many xled flights to make up for the cost of a third pilot.
12-21-2011, 01:25 PM
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Bingo! They won't ask the question because they know the answer.
12-21-2011, 01:36 PM
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12-21-2011, 01:55 PM
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12-21-2011, 01:58 PM
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Prior to duty, a crewmember must have a rest period as defined by 117.25(e):
(e) No certificate holder may schedule and no flightcrew member may accept an assignment for any reserve or flight duty period unless the flightcrew member is given a rest period of at least 10 consecutive hours immediately before beginning the reserve or flight duty period measured from the time the flightcrew member is released from duty. The 10 hour rest period must provide the flightcrew member with a minimum of 8 uninterrupted hours of sleep opportunity.
Stated more simply: When you go off-duty, you must be able to look back and identify a ten-hour rest period, eight of which must be an uninterrupted sleep opportunity, that took place immediately prior to signing in for duty.
And on top of that, we have to report if we don't get it (117.25(f)):
(f) If a flightcrew member determines that a rest period under paragraph (e) of this section will not provide eight uninterrupted hours of sleep opportunity, the flightcrew member must notify the certificate holder. The flightcrew member cannot report for the assigned flight duty period until he or she receives a rest period specified in paragraph (e) of this section.
(d) As part of the dispatch or flight release, as applicable, each flightcrew member must affirmatively state he or she is fit for duty prior to commencing flight.
One thing is for certain: It will take a while to find out how the various players interpret these new regulations, and there's going to be some battles.
We live in interesting times.
12-21-2011, 02:01 PM
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I still only read it as saying we must be scheduled for 10 hours rest.
12-21-2011, 02:16 PM
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Cargo exclusion : despicable, if not criminal........
12-21-2011, 02:21 PM
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Position: A-320A
Posts: 18,563
It is all about the context of what they are discussing.
in the NPRM commuting and rest was addressed specifically. I do not see it addressed specifically in the rule making like it was in the NPRM. Suffice to say more of that stuff was study and report back. Because of that language in the NPRM, if they try to apply this to commuting, the majority position should be that there was no study and no report ergo it does not apply to the time before your original report for duty.
If for some reason it does, the ATA will have a bird because there was no way for them to message their contracts with their labor groups. I see both sides not wanting to touch commuting with these FAR's. Of course Johnso, it depends on how the FAA "interprets" each little nugget they dropped in this new FAR.
in the NPRM commuting and rest was addressed specifically. I do not see it addressed specifically in the rule making like it was in the NPRM. Suffice to say more of that stuff was study and report back. Because of that language in the NPRM, if they try to apply this to commuting, the majority position should be that there was no study and no report ergo it does not apply to the time before your original report for duty.
If for some reason it does, the ATA will have a bird because there was no way for them to message their contracts with their labor groups. I see both sides not wanting to touch commuting with these FAR's. Of course Johnso, it depends on how the FAA "interprets" each little nugget they dropped in this new FAR.
12-21-2011, 02:22 PM
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12-21-2011, 02:25 PM
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Posts: 121
The company may have to make pairings that report at 10AM or 12 noon with a scheduled rest period then your first flight is 8pm or 10 PM. That lets guys commute in and get rest on the co dime while in the crew room sleep area.
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