Any "Latest & Greatest" about Delta?
10-04-2011, 03:24 AM
veut gagner à la loterie
Joined APC: Apr 2008
Position: Light Chop
Posts: 23,286
And let me guess, give up 100 seaters but oh, oh, oh, they will have "limits" like "only 88 seats" (100 seater with a first class the way management wants to fly them anyway) and can only do a certain percentage of the "hub to hub" or whatever.
Doesn't one of the regional outsourcing black holes come up for renewal in about 2 years? I think it was one of the smaller ones with SKYW but I'm not sure who its with. Agree to end that and reduce the outsourced "large RJ's" by the same amount. 25% on day 1, then 10% on 1 year after signing (to make up for the 5% we lost over the last year as well as covering the next year) plus 1% more B fund plus COLA to our per diem (retroactive to the last time it was increased) a massive vacation overhaul in our favor and enough line holder and reserve work rule changes to make 2 more years palatable, reigning in the AK code share abuses, future guarantees of DL pilot beneficial JV's if any more are sought, early openers again with accelerated mediation language and guaranteed COLA plus an initial 10-20% at the end of 2 years if we haven't reached an agreement, fix the use it or lose it sick pay system and I would consider such an extension (depending on every single other line of fine print in the entire contract, any one bad line of which could torpedo the entire thing).
That would be a net 37ish% in 366 days with partial scope recapture/strengthening at all 3 levels of our airline plus the necessary improvements required to press on in the interim.
Oh and 33% more underboob. That is a strike item.
Doesn't one of the regional outsourcing black holes come up for renewal in about 2 years? I think it was one of the smaller ones with SKYW but I'm not sure who its with. Agree to end that and reduce the outsourced "large RJ's" by the same amount. 25% on day 1, then 10% on 1 year after signing (to make up for the 5% we lost over the last year as well as covering the next year) plus 1% more B fund plus COLA to our per diem (retroactive to the last time it was increased) a massive vacation overhaul in our favor and enough line holder and reserve work rule changes to make 2 more years palatable, reigning in the AK code share abuses, future guarantees of DL pilot beneficial JV's if any more are sought, early openers again with accelerated mediation language and guaranteed COLA plus an initial 10-20% at the end of 2 years if we haven't reached an agreement, fix the use it or lose it sick pay system and I would consider such an extension (depending on every single other line of fine print in the entire contract, any one bad line of which could torpedo the entire thing).
That would be a net 37ish% in 366 days with partial scope recapture/strengthening at all 3 levels of our airline plus the necessary improvements required to press on in the interim.
Oh and 33% more underboob. That is a strike item.
10-04-2011, 03:40 AM
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Feb 2008
Posts: 2,539
10-04-2011, 03:58 AM
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Jun 2010
Posts: 631
Yeah, knowing about things like mergers where we wind up with 5.6% of the company and over 20% increase in direct compensation, or Joint Ventures where we get unprecedented production balance protections compared to the results of those non-NDA signing union guys...
I can see where you think those things are nonsense.
Sheesh....
I can see where you think those things are nonsense.
Sheesh....
10-04-2011, 04:01 AM
The Brown Dot +1
Joined APC: Jun 2009
Position: 777B
Posts: 7,775
Yeah, knowing about things like mergers where we wind up with 5.6% of the company and over 20% increase in direct compensation, or Joint Ventures where we get unprecedented production balance protections compared to the results of those non-NDA signing union guys...
I can see where you think those things are nonsense.
Sheesh....
I can see where you think those things are nonsense.
Sheesh....
Slow;
Seems to me that 5.6% of the company cost us about 3-4 times the market cap of the company at bankruptcy exit. What a deal! Why doesnt ALPA recommend that the pilots buy Comair for a couple billion too.
You spin your way, I'll spin my way.
10-04-2011, 05:03 AM
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Oct 2005
Position: Left, left, left right left....
Posts: 911
It's not an alternate universe ace. It's exactly how things were back when ALPA behaved like a union instead of the communications arm of management.
I personally told one of our managers that we all know negotiations is just sanctioned lying. Why would I need to sign an NDA to hear your lies when I know you'll just tell me without an NDA? At least without your NDA, I can tell my members about your lies. He just laughed, and I smiled back.
NDA's do nothing but separate union leaders from their members. Which is precisely what management wants.
Carl
I personally told one of our managers that we all know negotiations is just sanctioned lying. Why would I need to sign an NDA to hear your lies when I know you'll just tell me without an NDA? At least without your NDA, I can tell my members about your lies. He just laughed, and I smiled back.
NDA's do nothing but separate union leaders from their members. Which is precisely what management wants.
Carl
I suggest you call your Reps, past or present, and they can give you numerous historical examples of where the NDA has given this pilot group advantages they would not have had otherwise. Being privy to corporate intel and plans ahead of the market and your competitors does not make you "in bed" with them. There are numerous times our interests align, just as there are numerous times they do not. Being opportunistic when they do to our collective advantage is bad how?
If you want to believe in grassy knolls behind every ALPA action there is no hope in a logical discussion.
10-04-2011, 06:25 AM
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Jan 2010
Posts: 1,503
This brought to you by the same folks who brought us the negotiated end of 3b6.
What was it that they got for that? Something extremely valuable right??
We need professionals in there, Giant conflicts of interest are in play now.
10-04-2011, 06:26 AM
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Oct 2006
Position: Dismayed
Posts: 1,598
We interrupt this section 6 discussion with the following urgent message regarding the upcoming Red River Rivalry:
We now return to our regularly scheduled b!tching.
We now return to our regularly scheduled b!tching.
10-04-2011, 06:28 AM
Moderator
Joined APC: Oct 2006
Position: B757/767
Posts: 13,088
I'll ask again. Have we seen any successful snapbacks? It's a honest question.
10-04-2011, 06:46 AM
At home on the maddog!
Joined APC: Mar 2009
Position: ATL MD-88A
Posts: 2,874
10-04-2011, 06:56 AM
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Jul 2010
Position: window seat
Posts: 12,544
Yeah, knowing about things like mergers where we wind up with 5.6% of the company and over 20% increase in direct compensation, or Joint Ventures where we get unprecedented production balance protections compared to the results of those non-NDA signing union guys...
I can see where you think those things are nonsense.
Sheesh....
I can see where you think those things are nonsense.
Sheesh....
The pilot group(s) had a certain amount of leverage to go along with the merger. That is what resulted in the zero% pay increase (COLA is not a raise).
Now perhaps it would have come in handy to tell our benevolent secret keepers about the holes in the RAH agreement or how the company intended to abuse the daylights out of the AK code share. Those things would have been useful to know.
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