Any "Latest & Greatest" about Delta?
10-02-2011, 01:24 PM
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Jan 2010
Posts: 1,503
If I was the on the board of that company (you the line pilot) I would not want to declare CH7 and start a new company, I would want to find a way to create value in the current one. I would demand that my CEO (LEC Reps) clean house, and if they did not they would be gone too.
However, instead of "creating value and demanding the CEO clean house," I see that the more effective way to change is to force an LBO/take over.
You are forgetiing that the house not only has a leaking basement but is also structurally unsound. It is as if it has irrepairable termite damage.
10-02-2011, 01:31 PM
At home on the maddog!
Joined APC: Mar 2009
Position: ATL MD-88A
Posts: 2,874
Interesting analogy and way to look at this impassioned debate.
However, instead of "creating value and demanding the CEO clean house," I see that the more effective way to change is to force an LBO/take over.
You are forgetiing that the house not only has a leaking basement but is also structurally unsound. It is as if it has irrepairable termite damage.
However, instead of "creating value and demanding the CEO clean house," I see that the more effective way to change is to force an LBO/take over.
You are forgetiing that the house not only has a leaking basement but is also structurally unsound. It is as if it has irrepairable termite damage.
10-02-2011, 01:38 PM
The Brown Dot +1
Joined APC: Jun 2009
Position: 777B
Posts: 7,775
If National negotiated not just signed your contract, you may have a point. With regards to what National does for major v regional pilots, lets look at issues they have a real stake in. Legislative, Regulatory, Safety Related, etc. All of those issues are issues every pilot group agrees on.
Frankly, all of the ALPA services are bought by our dues dollars, and at a cheaper price than we would do as a stand a lone association. When they are working for us, they work for our goals, not some other groups. Lets do away with that notion. This of course does not imply that certain individuals that have been at national have not had incorrect or failed policies. That comes down to a people/ individual leader issue, not an organization issue.
I much prefer to fight collectively on issues than as individual pilot groups. You see that the proposed limit for a new 121 pilot will be almost 500% higher than it is today. That is a major win. It may not be 1500 hrs, but it is to the point that someone needs a flying job before flying 121 passengers. Furthermore, it is also attainable enough that the argument for the MPL will fall on deaf ears.
Frankly, all of the ALPA services are bought by our dues dollars, and at a cheaper price than we would do as a stand a lone association. When they are working for us, they work for our goals, not some other groups. Lets do away with that notion. This of course does not imply that certain individuals that have been at national have not had incorrect or failed policies. That comes down to a people/ individual leader issue, not an organization issue.
I much prefer to fight collectively on issues than as individual pilot groups. You see that the proposed limit for a new 121 pilot will be almost 500% higher than it is today. That is a major win. It may not be 1500 hrs, but it is to the point that someone needs a flying job before flying 121 passengers. Furthermore, it is also attainable enough that the argument for the MPL will fall on deaf ears.
ACL;
We all know where you stand and respect your well informed opinions. But I gotta throw the BS flag on this post, so I quoted it as a placeholder. There are 5 pages for me to read, if this hasn't been sufficiently squashed in those pages, I'll take a swing.
10-02-2011, 01:51 PM
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Jan 2010
Posts: 1,503
Today we have a handful of major airlines that basically subsidize many regionals.
Today we have conflict of interest with the same regionals, and newer ones, as they fly larger equipment in greater numbers than in '95
Today we have potentially bankrupting judgements against ALPA being decided after a jury has found them guilt of DFR.
Today we have airlines living under bankruptcy contracts struggling to restore wages and benefits while a tone deaf ALPA continues to live lavishly.
I could go on and on; I'll leave it for others.
However, ALPA is now like an over extended game of Jenga. One mistep and the whole structure comes down. If DAL left ALPA, could they survive without the revenue? Would the other members agree that an increase in dues would be exceptable to maintain ALPA? Would we agree to that if UAL left and DAL remained? How about an assesment to cover their legal failings?
Point is ACL, PPA and DPA are not even comparable. In all likelihood if DPA or UPA or any other independent is formed, it will be due to self inflicted wounds on ALPA's part. And that over extended game of Jenga, they are the only one playing it now and pulling pieces out of it. DPA can wait til it crashes down, then rebuild. They might not even have to push for the extra 2000 cards. They will come in in numbers greater than that when the wound comes.
The potentially biggest self inflicted wound will be the opener.
Good night. Got football to catch up on now that I can find real football on tv. Not that round ball stuff.
Last edited by TheManager; 10-02-2011 at 02:02 PM.
10-02-2011, 01:55 PM
The Brown Dot +1
Joined APC: Jun 2009
Position: 777B
Posts: 7,775
Any opinions, or has anyone tried, Financial Engines service to manage your 401K?
I looked around last year for a service to manage my "portfolio*" and every one wanted me to come out from my 50% cash position and go 100% into their fund families. That did not seem like such a hot idea and so far I am down about 7% for the year on the balanced funds. The best investment of the year has been a 4% cash loan to myself.
It is amazing how poorly the 401K has performed. On the other hand my taxable play money invested locally has done quite well.
Anybody doing anything that works without constant babysitting?
Retirement for us is going to be a lot different than it has been for our parents (and Leo and Michelle
)
* Akin to my daughter's hamsters talking about their "Mansion"
I looked around last year for a service to manage my "portfolio*" and every one wanted me to come out from my 50% cash position and go 100% into their fund families. That did not seem like such a hot idea and so far I am down about 7% for the year on the balanced funds. The best investment of the year has been a 4% cash loan to myself.
It is amazing how poorly the 401K has performed. On the other hand my taxable play money invested locally has done quite well.
Anybody doing anything that works without constant babysitting?
Retirement for us is going to be a lot different than it has been for our parents (and Leo and Michelle
)* Akin to my daughter's hamsters talking about their "Mansion"
This is not intended as financial advice, DYODD, you are responsible for your own actions.
Bar; FWIW
If you haven't set up a brokeragelink do it first thing monday morning. Put all available investable assets there (sitting in a tax exempt moneymarket trust). The market is going to fall off a cliff within the next 2 weeks... sooner rather than later.
Wait for the market to hit bottom...by 3rd week in Oct. Buy a good 3X etf like tna or erx. Plan to sell in april sometime and shift your holdings to a 3X inverse etf like FAZ. Rinse repeat. Not much babysitting required.
FWIW, from the guy who bought erx monday (not friday) at 30.80 and sold tues for 38, a 25% gain in two days in full view of you folks.
Again, not investment advice, do your own due diligence, your mileage may vary, you are responsible for your own actions, etc.
10-02-2011, 01:57 PM
Happy to be here
Joined APC: Jun 2006
Position: A-320A
Posts: 18,563
Different time and era.
Today we have a handful of major airlines that basically subsidize many regionals.
Today we have conflict of interest with the same regionals, and newer ones, as they fly larger equipment in greater numbers than in '95
Today we have potentially bankrupting judgements against ALPA being decided after a jury has found them guilt of DFR.
Today we have airlines living under bankruptcy contracts struggling to restore wages and benefits while a tone deaf ALPA continues to live lavishly.
I could go on and on; I'll leave it for others.
However, ALPA is now like an over extended game of Jenga. One mistep and the whole structure comes down. If DAL left ALPA, could they survive without the revenue? Would the other members agree that an increase in dues would be exceptable to maintain ALPA? Would we agree to that if UAL left and DAL remained? How about an assesment to cover their legal failings?
Point is ACL, PPA and DPA are not even comparable. In all likelihood if DPA or UPA or any other independent is formed as a result of a move from ALPA, ift will be due to self inflicted wounds.
The potentially biggest self inflicted wound will be the opener.
Today we have a handful of major airlines that basically subsidize many regionals.
Today we have conflict of interest with the same regionals, and newer ones, as they fly larger equipment in greater numbers than in '95
Today we have potentially bankrupting judgements against ALPA being decided after a jury has found them guilt of DFR.
Today we have airlines living under bankruptcy contracts struggling to restore wages and benefits while a tone deaf ALPA continues to live lavishly.
I could go on and on; I'll leave it for others.
However, ALPA is now like an over extended game of Jenga. One mistep and the whole structure comes down. If DAL left ALPA, could they survive without the revenue? Would the other members agree that an increase in dues would be exceptable to maintain ALPA? Would we agree to that if UAL left and DAL remained? How about an assesment to cover their legal failings?
Point is ACL, PPA and DPA are not even comparable. In all likelihood if DPA or UPA or any other independent is formed as a result of a move from ALPA, ift will be due to self inflicted wounds.
The potentially biggest self inflicted wound will be the opener.
I would love for DPA to be the answer, but it isn't. Given where this industry is going, and what we will be dealing with in the next decade, a National Union with localized MEC's is the only way to fight against the effects of Transnational airlines. Ergo, we have to fix it. If we as a group choose not to, we will suffer the effects of turning inward.
10-02-2011, 02:08 PM
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Jan 2010
Posts: 1,503
We will more than likely not see the opener(s)
I would love for DPA to be the answer, but it isn't. Given where this industry is going, and what we will be dealing with in the next decade, a National Union with localized MEC's is the only way to fight against the effects of Transnational airlines. Ergo, we have to fix it. If we as a group choose not to, we will suffer the effects of turning inward.
I would love for DPA to be the answer, but it isn't. Given where this industry is going, and what we will be dealing with in the next decade, a National Union with localized MEC's is the only way to fight against the effects of Transnational airlines. Ergo, we have to fix it. If we as a group choose not to, we will suffer the effects of turning inward.
And while you are at it, how about foreign ownership?
10-02-2011, 02:16 PM
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Jan 2010
Posts: 1,503
We will more than likely not see the opener(s)
I would love for DPA to be the answer, but it isn't. Given where this industry is going, and what we will be dealing with in the next decade, a National Union with localized MEC's is the only way to fight against the effects of Transnational airlines. Ergo, we have to fix it. If we as a group choose not to, we will suffer the effects of turning inward.
I would love for DPA to be the answer, but it isn't. Given where this industry is going, and what we will be dealing with in the next decade, a National Union with localized MEC's is the only way to fight against the effects of Transnational airlines. Ergo, we have to fix it. If we as a group choose not to, we will suffer the effects of turning inward.
http://video.google.com/videoplay?do...4325139005442#
10-02-2011, 02:20 PM
At home on the maddog!
Joined APC: Mar 2009
Position: ATL MD-88A
Posts: 2,874
10-02-2011, 02:26 PM
Happy to be here
Joined APC: Jun 2006
Position: A-320A
Posts: 18,563
You will not be able to fight it. That is the point. You need to be part of the process to make it as pro pilot as possible. Fighting something like that with a far left/right position will result in you being ignored. If that were to happen, we would get what we get, and have no say in the limitations on it. I suspect that we will see foreign ownership limits to up to at least 49% by the end of the decade, and the ability for Transnational airlines to exist sometime in the early 2020's. All of this will be earlier if we have a greater financial crisis. The need for money and viability will control this, no matter how bad it may be.
The only way to fight against it, if ALPA were to take that position is one of National Autonomy. It is a great argument, and one that need not be ignored.
With being in the foundation of this issue, you have to have cutouts that allow for National Security issues, labor contracts to not just be acknowledged but adhered to by foreign corporations and counties. Unions recognized and the arbitration and grievance process to be codified with these countries and governing bodies. None of that would take much of a precedence if we were to take a polarized position.
The real world dictates that we realize that a lot will happen that we may not like, but that we need to be a party to the discussion none the less.
It is like RA and Carbon Offsets. He hates it, but became the head of it, because he knew that it could not stop it, and the best way to manage it, was to be part of the organization and team that determined its scope from the onset.
If you wanted to deal with it from a ALPA level and totally kill it, this contract would need to have wording in it from the MEC level that basically stated that no Transnational airlines or foreign ownership would be allowed without MEC approval through a MEMRAT process. ALPA National cannot do that. Our MEC can. We can also deal with a lot of the "what-if's" by binding holding companies and have language that reaches though holding companies to other corporate entities.
Again, it is not the answer that you want, but it is the answer that will give you the best results over a longer period of time.
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