Any "Latest & Greatest" about Delta?
09-18-2011, 07:31 PM
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Is this new or old? Actually it has happened yet, it's a September 19th, 2011 article from 12pm... but it is in Australia so it has happened. But sometimes articles are rehashes of things we already knew...
Virgin Australia and Delta launch codeshare deal | Herald Sun
Virgin Australia and Delta launch codeshare deal | Herald Sun
From the article it looks like a 3:1 deal:
3 VA routes
1 DAL route
That's a bad deal because I feel it's not worth loosening scope to protect a SYD layover.
Even if we get the next growth route, thats an awful lot of promise to sell scope to an airline that itself has horrible scope with multiple certificates and multiple seniority lists and is in bed with Emirates to boot. If nothing it's poor trade-unionism to support that.
There was a rumor of DAL picking up a West Coast -> MEL route.
If that's the case, the deal is better for DAL pilots, but we're still supporting the intl. equivalent of a go-jets type operation...
Funny thing is you might buy a Delta ticket, but fly on a SkyWest* flight on either side of the Pacific...
At the very least the LOA should stipulate that only flight flown by Delta pilots may be sold as part of the JV.
Cheers
George
*Skywest in Australia, note the spelling difference!
Last edited by georgetg; 09-18-2011 at 08:24 PM. Reason: less incoherent, bold
09-18-2011, 07:38 PM
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Ahh....the Bears. Their non-existent offensive line is obviously the reason behind my posting of the sad clown.
No. It was really the beginning of another SLI debate that did it. I'm guessing it's because we are talking about reductions (again) instead of expansion or upwards movement. For the record, I hope the next AE oracle brings some good news for everyone.
No. It was really the beginning of another SLI debate that did it. I'm guessing it's because we are talking about reductions (again) instead of expansion or upwards movement. For the record, I hope the next AE oracle brings some good news for everyone.
As to football... Cam Newton is on pace to pass for 6,832 yards this season far surpassing Dan Marino's 1984 5,084 yards.
Not bad for a rookie that's not smart enough to play in the NFL, will never learn how to play, can't pass, ran in a gimmicky college system and is only a running qb.ATL got lucky.
Last edited by forgot to bid; 09-18-2011 at 07:50 PM.
09-18-2011, 09:00 PM
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Really?
Merged Delta was the only legacy airline not to furlough during the last downturn. In fact, Delta hired 305 since the merger. Two early out programs took a fair number of guys off the top, but even with the retirement of two uneconomic fleets there were no furloughs.
That reality conflicts with the perception posted above.
Merged Delta was the only legacy airline not to furlough during the last downturn. In fact, Delta hired 305 since the merger. Two early out programs took a fair number of guys off the top, but even with the retirement of two uneconomic fleets there were no furloughs.
That reality conflicts with the perception posted above.
The point remains that a merger would be bad for at least half the pilots on the Delta list.
It would be better to grow organically, as Delta was trying to do under Jim White before the BOD's futile pump and dump (day I was hired DAL was >$21.00 a share, on day after merger announcement DAL <$8.00) Bottom line, if this Company can not grow, then it can't make much out of a merger either. Organic growth is cheaper over the long term.
Am I grateful to have a job? You bet I am. But, it does not change the dynamic a merger would have on our pilots.
What did Air France / KLM get for their three quarters of a Billion dollars? ($750,000,000.00) A feeder?
09-18-2011, 10:53 PM
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As to football... Cam Newton is on pace to pass for 6,832 yards this season far surpassing Dan Marino's 1984 5,084 yards. Not bad for a rookie that's not smart enough to play in the NFL, will never learn how to play, can't pass, ran in a gimmicky college system and is only a running qb.
Not bad for a rookie that's not smart enough to play in the NFL, will never learn how to play, can't pass, ran in a gimmicky college system and is only a running qb.Those would be records also.
09-19-2011, 03:39 AM
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It would be better to grow organically, as Delta was trying to do under Jim White before the BOD's futile pump and dump (day I was hired DAL was >$21.00 a share, on day after merger announcement DAL <$8.00) Bottom line, if this Company can not grow, then it can't make much out of a merger either. Organic growth is cheaper over the long term.
He talked a great game telling each employee group what they wanted to hear, then doing nothing except change his story for the next group. He was also a big Kolshak promoter. But he sure was an effective negotiator for the company at the Paris Air Show...
09-19-2011, 04:13 AM
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Really?
Merged Delta was the only legacy airline not to furlough during the last downturn. In fact, Delta hired 305 since the merger. Two early out programs took a fair number of guys off the top, but even with the retirement of two uneconomic fleets there were no furloughs.
That reality conflicts with the perception posted above. Merger setting them back? Ask the bottom 1450 at UAL, the bottom 10% of Alaska, the bottom 1700 at AMR, the 147 at CAL. Heck, even a bunch of the regionals furloughed. That's being set back.
Merged Delta was the only legacy airline not to furlough during the last downturn. In fact, Delta hired 305 since the merger. Two early out programs took a fair number of guys off the top, but even with the retirement of two uneconomic fleets there were no furloughs.
That reality conflicts with the perception posted above. Merger setting them back?
Ask the bottom 1450 at UAL, the bottom 10% of Alaska, the bottom 1700 at AMR, the 147 at CAL. Heck, even a bunch of the regionals furloughed. That's being set back.
09-19-2011, 04:13 AM
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And Newton would have 32 int's if the average held. Which is 1/4 of what Big Ben is out to do on turnovers and they'll probably still make the playoffs.
09-19-2011, 04:15 AM
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09-19-2011, 04:15 AM
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Slow,
All true, but little consolation for a lot of our junior guys. We are stagnating. Guys off the top don't really help guys on the bottom too much if we don't hire and grow.
For example, and I do realize that this is exaggerated, but it makes the point. If the top 25% leave the 2nd quartile is now mostly the top (huge benefit). The third quartile moves up to mostly the 2nd (large benefit) but the bottom 25% are pretty much still the bottom, albeit now reaching up to 33% on the list (marginal to zero benefit).
Granted UAL and AMR are worse but every Pilot hired after about 1999 would be making more if they instead went to Southwest, FDX, Jet Blue, Virgin (mostly), Atlas, and who knows who else.
I am hoping our next contract will change that and who knows what the future holds, but as of now every Pilot hired after around 1999 at the worlds biggest airline would have been better off going to a lot of other airlines. I would think this would be a concern for all DAL Pilots - realizing that guys would have been better off going to LCC's.
This is why the junior guys fixate on Scope.
Scoop
All true, but little consolation for a lot of our junior guys. We are stagnating. Guys off the top don't really help guys on the bottom too much if we don't hire and grow.
For example, and I do realize that this is exaggerated, but it makes the point. If the top 25% leave the 2nd quartile is now mostly the top (huge benefit). The third quartile moves up to mostly the 2nd (large benefit) but the bottom 25% are pretty much still the bottom, albeit now reaching up to 33% on the list (marginal to zero benefit).
Granted UAL and AMR are worse but every Pilot hired after about 1999 would be making more if they instead went to Southwest, FDX, Jet Blue, Virgin (mostly), Atlas, and who knows who else.
I am hoping our next contract will change that and who knows what the future holds, but as of now every Pilot hired after around 1999 at the worlds biggest airline would have been better off going to a lot of other airlines. I would think this would be a concern for all DAL Pilots - realizing that guys would have been better off going to LCC's.
This is why the junior guys fixate on Scope.
Scoop
09-19-2011, 04:51 AM
The Brown Dot +1
Joined APC: Jun 2009
Position: 777B
Posts: 7,775
Slow,
All true, but little consolation for a lot of our junior guys. We are stagnating. Guys off the top don't really help guys on the bottom too much if we don't hire and grow.
For example, and I do realize that this is exaggerated, but it makes the point. If the top 25% leave the 2nd quartile is now mostly the top (huge benefit). The third quartile moves up to mostly the 2nd (large benefit) but the bottom 25% are pretty much still the bottom, albeit now reaching up to 33% on the list (marginal to zero benefit).
Granted UAL and AMR are worse but every Pilot hired after about 1999 would be making more if they instead went to Southwest, FDX, Jet Blue, Virgin (mostly), Atlas, and who knows who else.
I am hoping our next contract will change that and who knows what the future holds, but as of now every Pilot hired after around 1999 at the worlds biggest airline would have been better off going to a lot of other airlines. I would think this would be a concern for all DAL Pilots - realizing that guys would have been better off going to LCC's.
This is why the junior guys fixate on Scope.
Scoop
All true, but little consolation for a lot of our junior guys. We are stagnating. Guys off the top don't really help guys on the bottom too much if we don't hire and grow.
For example, and I do realize that this is exaggerated, but it makes the point. If the top 25% leave the 2nd quartile is now mostly the top (huge benefit). The third quartile moves up to mostly the 2nd (large benefit) but the bottom 25% are pretty much still the bottom, albeit now reaching up to 33% on the list (marginal to zero benefit).
Granted UAL and AMR are worse but every Pilot hired after about 1999 would be making more if they instead went to Southwest, FDX, Jet Blue, Virgin (mostly), Atlas, and who knows who else.
I am hoping our next contract will change that and who knows what the future holds, but as of now every Pilot hired after around 1999 at the worlds biggest airline would have been better off going to a lot of other airlines. I would think this would be a concern for all DAL Pilots - realizing that guys would have been better off going to LCC's.
This is why the junior guys fixate on Scope.
Scoop
I flew with a 777A on reserve a couple trips ago. SWA FO's make as much or more than him. Gear slingers on a 135 seat jet make more that a polar route flying, risk mitigating, 270 seat international captain at the worlds (2nd) largest airline.
I guess the same holds true for the 400 seat jet 747 reserve captains.
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