Any "Latest & Greatest" about Delta?
09-06-2011, 03:14 AM
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Feb 2008
Posts: 19,614
I don't know this for a fact, but I hope the reason the DPA guys are continuing is because of people like me urging them NOT to suspend activities under any circumstances. My opinion is that the DPA's existence is the only reason DALPA hasn't already caved in scope via LOA prior to Section 6.
ALPA has no political relationships, with one exception: Politicians take ALPA's (our) money and allow ALPA a seat at the table. That's the relationship. That's it. The sooner everyone gets past the ALPA advertising slogans, the sooner you'll be able to understand what's going on around you.
I'm surprised you still say things like this. Do you not pay attention to very recent history? The problem at American is not the APA as a union. The problem at American is the widely varied opinion of the pilots. Some of them are "constructive engagement" types. Others are not and want to get complete restoration plus cost of living back all in the first year. ALPA thought they could come in and show APA how it's done. But what happened? The first time ALPA was publicly insulted for being secretive and having ulterior motives, ALPA very publicly withdrew their services and walked away from the pilots of American.
The question you should be asking yourself is: What will ALPA do differently this time now that they've apparently rejoined APA? Because so far, ALPA has only served to delay APA's contract hopes for the entire time ALPA has been there.
Carl
ALPA has no political relationships, with one exception: Politicians take ALPA's (our) money and allow ALPA a seat at the table. That's the relationship. That's it. The sooner everyone gets past the ALPA advertising slogans, the sooner you'll be able to understand what's going on around you.
I'm surprised you still say things like this. Do you not pay attention to very recent history? The problem at American is not the APA as a union. The problem at American is the widely varied opinion of the pilots. Some of them are "constructive engagement" types. Others are not and want to get complete restoration plus cost of living back all in the first year. ALPA thought they could come in and show APA how it's done. But what happened? The first time ALPA was publicly insulted for being secretive and having ulterior motives, ALPA very publicly withdrew their services and walked away from the pilots of American.
The question you should be asking yourself is: What will ALPA do differently this time now that they've apparently rejoined APA? Because so far, ALPA has only served to delay APA's contract hopes for the entire time ALPA has been there.
Carl
Short Version. Last fall the NMB told APA that their expectations and methods were unacceptable to the NMB. The NMB kicked them out of mediation however did not release them. This effectively gave management a blank check to keep APA on the current contract forever. The NMB also told APA to get help. Since bringing in some assistance from ALPA they have had more meetings and more progress then the 4 years before. They also have some credibility with the NMB when before they had none.
There is another union that felt that a working relationship with the NMB and influence in DC is unimportant. Its called USAPA. Ask them how the grievance process has been working for them lately?
09-06-2011, 03:28 AM
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Apr 2008
Posts: 1,462
Carl, APA has made more progress since last Dec then the 4 years plus prior to that. They have been holding far more meeting with the company ect.. Why is that? Do you know how ALPA came into the process? I know that you do. You just wont post what happened.
Short Version. Last fall the NMB told APA that their expectations and methods were unacceptable to the NMB. The NMB kicked them out of mediation however did not release them. This effectively gave management a blank check to keep APA on the current contract forever. The NMB also told APA to get help. Since bringing in some assistance from ALPA they have had more meetings and more progress then the 4 years before. They also have some credibility with the NMB when before they had none.
There is another union that felt that a working relationship with the NMB and influence in DC is unimportant. Its called USAPA. Ask them how the grievance process has been working for them lately?
Short Version. Last fall the NMB told APA that their expectations and methods were unacceptable to the NMB. The NMB kicked them out of mediation however did not release them. This effectively gave management a blank check to keep APA on the current contract forever. The NMB also told APA to get help. Since bringing in some assistance from ALPA they have had more meetings and more progress then the 4 years before. They also have some credibility with the NMB when before they had none.
There is another union that felt that a working relationship with the NMB and influence in DC is unimportant. Its called USAPA. Ask them how the grievance process has been working for them lately?
BTW, while we're looking for dysfunctional unions, click over to the Union Talk section and read up on FAPA. Another "go it alone" union in self destruct mode.
Hmm. APA, USAPA, FAPA... and people want DPA?
09-06-2011, 03:33 AM
No longer cares
Joined APC: Mar 2008
Position: 767er Captain
Posts: 12,109
But then again, that is all done thru PAC monies, which are separate from dues monies by law (thank goodness) and I am pretty sure that ALPA being ALPA they wouldn't turn down a donation from a non-ALPA carrier... so.. what's the next argument?
09-06-2011, 03:36 AM
No longer cares
Joined APC: Mar 2008
Position: 767er Captain
Posts: 12,109
09-06-2011, 03:40 AM
No longer cares
Joined APC: Mar 2008
Position: 767er Captain
Posts: 12,109
Carl, APA has made more progress since last Dec then the 4 years plus prior to that. They have been holding far more meeting with the company ect.. Why is that? Do you know how ALPA came into the process? I know that you do. You just wont post what happened.
Short Version. Last fall the NMB told APA that their expectations and methods were unacceptable to the NMB. The NMB kicked them out of mediation however did not release them. This effectively gave management a blank check to keep APA on the current contract forever. The NMB also told APA to get help. Since bringing in some assistance from ALPA they have had more meetings and more progress then the 4 years before. They also have some credibility with the NMB when before they had none.
There is another union that felt that a working relationship with the NMB and influence in DC is unimportant. Its called USAPA. Ask them how the grievance process has been working for them lately?
Short Version. Last fall the NMB told APA that their expectations and methods were unacceptable to the NMB. The NMB kicked them out of mediation however did not release them. This effectively gave management a blank check to keep APA on the current contract forever. The NMB also told APA to get help. Since bringing in some assistance from ALPA they have had more meetings and more progress then the 4 years before. They also have some credibility with the NMB when before they had none.
There is another union that felt that a working relationship with the NMB and influence in DC is unimportant. Its called USAPA. Ask them how the grievance process has been working for them lately?
09-06-2011, 04:01 AM
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Feb 2009
Position: 320B
Posts: 781
I heard about that CrewPass thingy. Yeah, I remember when it first started, buddy of mine (SWA) said it was great using it at BWI. Been using it for a long time there. Problem for me is that the only terminal that gets it there is a SWA terminal. It would appear that SWAPA actually has some decent influence in DC.
09-06-2011, 05:05 AM
veut gagner à la loterie
Joined APC: Apr 2008
Position: Light Chop
Posts: 23,286
I heard about that CrewPass thingy. Yeah, I remember when it first started, buddy of mine (SWA) said it was great using it at BWI. Been using it for a long time there. Problem for me is that the only terminal that gets it there is a SWA terminal. It would appear that SWAPA actually has some decent influence in DC.
It's funny how they got it first.
But speaking of decent influence, let us not forget how the DOT took SWA position in the slot swap and we countered with everyone but SWA and forced the DOT to admit - no SWA then no deal.
09-06-2011, 05:19 AM
Moderator
Joined APC: Oct 2006
Position: B757/767
Posts: 13,088
Hey Guys,
Sorry to interrupt the current discourse, but a quick question: I'm flying a lot this month with a regular line. Looks like my time card is already crediting 5 hours to my bank. I don't really want to credit any time to my bank. What's up with this and can I have them not credit the time and just pay me?
Thanks....and carry on.
B
Sorry to interrupt the current discourse, but a quick question: I'm flying a lot this month with a regular line. Looks like my time card is already crediting 5 hours to my bank. I don't really want to credit any time to my bank. What's up with this and can I have them not credit the time and just pay me?
Thanks....and carry on.
B
If your bank has a negative balance, & your monthly credit exceeds 80 hours they will automatically take up to 5 hours to pay back to your bank. IOW, of your monthly credit is 91 hours, your pay will be 86 hours. I'm not sure if you can opt out of that or not.
09-06-2011, 05:26 AM
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Jun 2010
Posts: 631
The opener can and should reflect the contract surveys put out by the pilots. If it does not then you have a valid point. You might however be quite surprised if you were allowed to read those surveys. When alone and thinking pilots tend to put down what they feel is reasonable and achievable.
Here is the problem that hopefully DALPA has solved or is working on: How are we line pilots supposed to believe the true results of the contract survey? Yeah...I know...it will be an outside company tallying the results and deriving statistical data...(paid for by whom?) Sorry for being skeptical...but...I will go out on a limb here and suggest that maybe, just maybe... it could be just a minor CONFLICT OF INTEREST to have DALPA tell us what the majority of us want?
I think a better barometer is to see what the opener is... and see if the opener causes the DPA website to crash due to overwhelming requests to download and send off cards....or not!?? Either way...that will really determine whether pilots feel their survey results were well-represented or fixed.
With exception to the DALPA guys...and a few other "complete the mission types" (CTM types) I have not heard anyone say they are willing to accept anything less that SWA; day one for MD88! It is frustrating to read some of the threads on the DALPA forum that suggest we will have to trade the bottom 1500 of the seniority list for these kind of gains! Crazy...but even more scary; it is coming from DALPA guys and not the usual koolaid drinking CTM types!
09-06-2011, 05:31 AM
ATL A320 B
Joined APC: Oct 2009
Position: No longer MEM or 9, but still a guy.
Posts: 238
I don't think you can opt out of this process, but you should still be able to do a bank transaction to withdraw 5 hours this month and make it a wash.
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