Any "Latest & Greatest" about Delta?
05-12-2011, 06:32 AM
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Feb 2008
Posts: 19,423
So we make less then are pre merger DAL counter parts, & that's fair?
Explain to me how making the same amount of $$$ is pay parity? You scream unity, but absolutely fail to support it in this instance. You know that we were hostages in this situation. We were on probation, & unable to vote on the PWA. We didnt even have the opportunity to elect thise who represented us. Now we simply ask to be brought to pay equal to rest of our fellow pilots, & you call it pay parity? Some unity.
These are the words of a lineholder who is out of touch with the reserve world. Fact of the matter is I've had scheduling build a DH on the last flight of the night that is a connection of less then 30 minutes. DAL DH's reserves more then any airline I know. I saw a friend on reserve DH DTW-ATL-CHS, then fly CHS-ATL, then DH ATL-DTW. That was a day trip. Tight connections on oversold planes. We need a better system.
Explain to me how making the same amount of $$$ is pay parity? You scream unity, but absolutely fail to support it in this instance. You know that we were hostages in this situation. We were on probation, & unable to vote on the PWA. We didnt even have the opportunity to elect thise who represented us. Now we simply ask to be brought to pay equal to rest of our fellow pilots, & you call it pay parity? Some unity.
These are the words of a lineholder who is out of touch with the reserve world. Fact of the matter is I've had scheduling build a DH on the last flight of the night that is a connection of less then 30 minutes. DAL DH's reserves more then any airline I know. I saw a friend on reserve DH DTW-ATL-CHS, then fly CHS-ATL, then DH ATL-DTW. That was a day trip. Tight connections on oversold planes. We need a better system.
You have either forgotten or simply are choosing to omit the ongoing funding requirements for the NWA defined benefit plan. That is the reason there was no parity at Day 1. The funding requirements are huge for the DB plan. When all the NWA pilots are on the same DC plan as the Delta pilots there will still be a large funding requirement to the DB plan. In the end the former NWA pilots will be getting a larger share of each dollar Delta spends for pilot retirements.
05-12-2011, 06:33 AM
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Mar 2008
Posts: 2,919
Don't have an answer to this, but since you brought it up I was curious how guys have handled getting the time off for when there pregnant wife gets close to delivering.
05-12-2011, 06:34 AM
Moderator
Joined APC: Oct 2006
Position: B757/767
Posts: 13,088
You have either forgotten or simply are choosing to omit the ongoing funding requirements for the NWA defined benefit plan. That is the reason there was no parity at Day 1. The funding requirements are huge for the DB plan. When all the NWA pilots are on the same DC plan as the Delta pilots there will still be a large funding requirement to the DB plan. In the end the former NWA pilots will be getting a larger share of each dollar Delta spends for pilot retirements.
So you support punishing me for something I am neither involved in, nor have any benefit from. You chose to support lower pay for fellow DALPA pilots. Some unity.
Last edited by johnso29; 05-12-2011 at 06:46 AM.
05-12-2011, 07:08 AM
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Dec 2007
Posts: 191
APD and PD are both unpaid. You can PD whenever you want but the reserve coverage has to be sufficient. APD, the reserve coverage can be much lower, but you only get one every year (your hire anniv year). I think it is up to a 4 day trip or 5 res days, not sure.
05-12-2011, 07:15 AM
Get's Every Day Off
Joined APC: Oct 2006
Position: Retired
Posts: 1,860
Um let's put it this way, I could not get comfortable in the sucker. The seats were very close together. Literally I could not get to my seat without using putting one leg on the seat pans themselves.
It does have a wider cross section, but the 88 has more leg room. The seats themselves are better made though. Overall a better design, but man that back end wags more than a 757/767. Ugh.
It does have a wider cross section, but the 88 has more leg room. The seats themselves are better made though. Overall a better design, but man that back end wags more than a 757/767. Ugh.
05-12-2011, 07:16 AM
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Mar 2008
Posts: 3,858
Or the resistance to publishing it could be a hold on to power grab as well
I've heard those claims too but think it is a straw man for not wanting to show how many people are on FPL, and what a good deal it can be for a select few on full time or almost full time status. The issue of both transparency and compensation is very germane to the line pilots who pay those costs either directly with dues out of their salaries, or through the contract for company paid expenses.
I've heard all the standard arguments of how hard ALPA volunteers work. No argument, and I'm grateful for the work done. That said no one should either profit or be harmed financially, and I think the vast majority of volunteers fall within a pretty reasonable standard deviation. The reasonable, responsible, and prudent FPL use of the majority is being used as a rational for not revealing the full details of FPL usage in my opinion. If it's all reasonable then show us.
I've heard those claims too but think it is a straw man for not wanting to show how many people are on FPL, and what a good deal it can be for a select few on full time or almost full time status. The issue of both transparency and compensation is very germane to the line pilots who pay those costs either directly with dues out of their salaries, or through the contract for company paid expenses.
I've heard all the standard arguments of how hard ALPA volunteers work. No argument, and I'm grateful for the work done. That said no one should either profit or be harmed financially, and I think the vast majority of volunteers fall within a pretty reasonable standard deviation. The reasonable, responsible, and prudent FPL use of the majority is being used as a rational for not revealing the full details of FPL usage in my opinion. If it's all reasonable then show us.
People forget there are actually two aspects to FPL. What the volunteer gets paid, and what it costs to pay him.
Just looking at what the pilot makes is only half the story. The other half is the money that ALPA has to compensate the company for the FPL, which includes a %35 premium to cover benefits and other items, which can be 2 to 3 times the hourly rate (if the company had to use a IA or GS to cover the dropped trip, for instance).
Only then do you get the full picture.
Some ALPA folks don't require ALPA to compensate the company for their FPL (the 26J pilots), BUT that money still came out of the total contract package. As the apologists would say "we had to give something up to get that".
Nu
05-12-2011, 07:34 AM
On Reserve
Joined APC: Dec 2008
Position: B76
Posts: 17
EXCUSE ME??!!!! What kind of GARBAGE is this?? How do you even try to justify in your head that this is relevant to the argument? A current DAL new hire was not involved in the merger, or making it work & therefore was never entitled to any shares.
To further shoot down this ridiculous attempt of a defense, what about a PMDAL hire who was in class around 3/08 and not only receives a higher DC but ALSO received the equity shares? How do you justify that?
To further shoot down this ridiculous attempt of a defense, what about a PMDAL hire who was in class around 3/08 and not only receives a higher DC but ALSO received the equity shares? How do you justify that?
05-12-2011, 07:38 AM
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Sep 2008
Position: Kickin’ Back
Posts: 6,971
When I was hired there was something about what I got paid that I didn't get to vote on either that I want corrected.................The loss of income from THE 5 YEAR B SCALE I had to endure! 
I'm not trying to sound callous but I get the impression that you young guys think we more senior guys have never gone thru similar situations that you face now. I tell you what, you get me the money that I lost via the B scale and I will cover at least 2 of you for your loss of DC contribution!
Then we only need one resolution to fix both problems!
Denny
PS. Standing by for incoming!!
I'm not trying to sound callous but I get the impression that you young guys think we more senior guys have never gone thru similar situations that you face now. I tell you what, you get me the money that I lost via the B scale and I will cover at least 2 of you for your loss of DC contribution!
Then we only need one resolution to fix both problems!Denny
PS. Standing by for incoming!!
05-12-2011, 07:42 AM
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Sep 2006
Position: Starboard Side, weekends & holidays.
Posts: 855
I bid around the due date, but my wife went into labor 3 weeks early while I was on a layover (and a really nice one, darnit!) CPSC was fantastic. Arranged for immediate positive space home for me and took care of my next trip as well.
05-12-2011, 07:44 AM
Happy to be here
Joined APC: Jun 2006
Position: A-320A
Posts: 18,563
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