Sink r8

OK, so you're debating this? I'm not sure if you're trying to make my point, or yours.

It's a lot more economical to furlough when the bottom of each category contains the junior pilot, than in an airline that's perfectly stovepiped. If you need to cut overall flying 20% (i.e. after 9/11), and you look at the 20% junior pilots, you find that (oops), that's 100% of you maddog F/O's, and 50% of your A320 F/O's. Now what? Well, you have to displace. The 88 F/O's "displace" to the street. The A320 guys to the 88, etc. Until enough displacements have occured, you can't operate the 80% of the 88 flying you still wish to perform, and you don't have enough for the A320 either. So you weigh this carefully. You look at the entire list, and ou calculate the cost of displacing 20% of the entire system, from the top fleet on down, and you have a powerful dissincentive to pull the trigger if you won't have enough time on furlough to recoup your costs.

This is why we didn't furlough in 2008: it wasn't worth it.

If you have a system that isn't stovepiped at all, all F/O's distributed somewhat evenly, depending on where they live, the flying they like, etc. The junior 20% of all pilots makes up about 40% of all F/O categories (I'm assuming we have the same number of A's and B's). Now, you don't need to wait until you have to retrain 80% of your 88 F/O's (the total flying you were performing, minus the 20% you don't want). You only need to train 20% of your 88 B's (40% of the guys getting furloughed, minus 20% cut in flying). The great news? You're displacing 20% of the Captains, too. And, better yet, 20% of your 88 Captains are already trained. Since you're in a LBP situation, chances are they're flying the 88 because they like it, so the geography and the flying already floats their boat. And since they won't make more money by displacing to a senior WB category (LBP for all, remember?), then they might as well stay as 88 B's. What's the downside?

So, under our existing rules, it takes months to get everyone on the street, and the replacements trained. Under a LBP sytem, the entire airline is potentially set up properly to chop off the bottom X % of any and all categories, no questions asked. Send the certified letters, and it's done!

So to answer you hypothetical about the 737 guy and the A320 guy, the answer is that the 737 under a LBP sytem wouldn't be senior or junior to the A320 guy, and since it's easy to chop off 20% of either category, he'd stay put. One less training event. One less cost to be factored in against a furlough.

This is the stuff that would have made Kolshack cream his pants. And Burns too, whatever she has in her pants.

scambo1

Post some porn, that'll get your point across.

Columbia

Yes- Sink exaggerated by saying operating nothing but B1900s which turned my random thought into a nutball thought worthy of dismissal. However, WB JV pressure will, IMO, increase potentially leading to a loss of WB flying done by dalpa pilots. It stands to reason that longevity pay would be a protection against the loss of WB pay scales.
I'm not necessarily an advocate for the change, but I am for the discussion by using "what if's" and not using only historical arguments or saying "Look at the regionals who use it and see how it is working for them."

acl65pilot

I am more worried about the rest of my career than what I can hold today. If we were totally stovepiped I would be on the 73N as a line holder.

Also, bid my current seat as a line holder, held nice four leg four day trips and then started moving backwards a few years ago. Not complaining but just pointing that out. My reason for where I am not is, I do not want to commit to a two year seat lock that may limit my options when more seats move. It has nothing to do with QOL. I made the decision to take a QOL hit to avoid another seat lock. Currently I do not get anything I bid for due to where I sit on the jet. Once the music stops, I will then bid off.

Yes, I am junior but have well over 10% of the total list below me.

1234

Delta bets on upgrades to lure new customers

Reuters

By Karen Jacobs

ATLANTA | Thu Mar 17, 2011 6:18am EDT

ATLANTA (Reuters) - Delta Air Lines Inc (DAL.N) may no longer be the world's biggest airline, but it's spending big in an effort to become a premium brand.

The airline is investing more than $2 billion through 2013 to upgrade plane seats, refurbish airport facilities and expand in-flight entertainment options to win new passengers and entice existing ones to spend more.

"People pay more for Mercedes than they do for Hyundais," Glen Hauenstein, Delta's executive vice president for network planning and revenue management, said in an interview.

"What we're trying to create is this higher-end product that people are willing to pay for."

There are no plans to scale back the spending even as fuel costs rise. "As a matter of fact, we're doing them as fast as we can," Hauenstein added.

The executive declined to comment on Delta's business in Japan following the earthquake. The company said Wednesday its Tokyo flights have not been cancelled and that operations were continuing as normal.

With the 2008 purchase of Northwest Airlines behind it, Delta is making investments to give flyers a good-better-best selection of product offerings, depending on their budget.

Delta is adding lie-flat seats to its first-class BusinessElite section for international routes and refurbishing U.S. airport lounges with full-service bars and new artwork. On U.S. flights, inflight Wi-Fi is being expanded to 223 Delta regional aircraft.

This summer, passengers on long international flights will be able to sit in a new Economy Comfort section with more legroom and seat recline for an additional $80 to $160 one-way.

Apart from the investments, Delta has made other changes to try to stand out from other carriers. This year, it eliminated the expiration of miles accrued under its SkyMiles frequent-flyer program. And Hauenstein said Delta has no plans to stop offering free complimentary snacks such as peanuts on its flights as some large U.S. rivals have done.

INTENSE COMPETITION

Henry Harteveldt, travel industry analyst with Forrester Research, said Delta's moves are designed to set it apart among consumers who can choose from airlines with similar products. United Continental Holdings (UAL.N) and AMR Corp's (AMR.N) American also have added lie-flat seats in recent years.

"Delta has an opportunity to compete for and win a lot of business from brand neutral or brand agnostic travellers," Harteveldt said.

Delta is mulling other upgrades longer-term. The company is talking to major plane makers this year as it considers ordering hundreds of new narrowbodies to fly U.S. routes.

As airlines merge, the battle for passengers is heating up. United Continental Holdings (UAL.N), which displaced Delta as the world's largest carrier after its 2010 merger, is looking to win international customers. Southwest Airlines' (LUV.N) planned purchase of AirTran Holdings (AAI.N) will bring new competition to Delta at its home base in Atlanta.

Terry Trippler, owner of travel website Airlinerulestoknow.com, said Delta is playing catch-up to some extent, as international terminals such as the one at JFK airport were long overdue for upgrades. But he added investing in the latest aircraft interiors on the market can give the carrier an edge, especially in attracting lucrative international travellers.

"Delta is going to be a real force to be reckoned with in the future," Trippler said.

acl65pilot

Bet the price of those JAL 744's took a hit. Might need a iodine bath but they will be good to go in no time!

acl65pilot

Oops, meant, IPA, not APA.

1234

North Dakota!!!!!!!

You were talking about the NCAA Hockey Tourney, weren't you.

gloopy

Y'all be goin' on vacation?

acl65pilot

From what I understand, there is a jet and crew in place to evacuate the entire place at a moments notice. Our VP of Flying Operations is over there as well as his and the SVP's SAS's. MEC is to have a meet and greet there next weekend.

Trust me, if it gets to a point where safety truly becomes a question, we will be out of there. (at least that is what I have been told by multiple ppl)