forgot to bid

Watch for a code share, like Alaska.

Delta Acela.

acl65pilot

Sorry the quote function did not take. A guy on the last page asked if there were pilot jobs in NRT and AMS. We do that flying for now was the response. I bet that we give a lot of the AMS to KLM with our joint agreement with AF/KLM. It is just a guess.

iaflyer

Remember, like the EF Hutton commercial, when ACL65pilot speaks, people listen!

iceman49

Sixty five, if we have a huge hub in AMS...why would we want to give any more flying to KLM then they already have through the commercial agreement. Pilots are upset about losing flying to the RJs, but loss of widebody flying will cause a huge waterfall downward. We should be just as concerned if not more so about the wide body flying since that is where you bring everyone one up...where are you getting your info from.

Sawdog

So there will be no management flying jobs in AMS or Narita? Just thought I would ask again. Being a Delta South guy, I did not know how NWA operated over there.

acl65pilot

I agree with what you say. I can tell you that RA was to meet with the President of KLM last week here in the US. I am betting that it was to further extend our endeavor of the AF/KLM deal to include more with KLM. They have publicly stated that they wanted to expand this deal to be more in line with the AF deal. It is not that we as a union want to. DAL shares the profits on the joint routes. The same can be done with KLM. Take the JFK-CDG route that we gave AF last summer. We do not fly it, but we share the revenue from it.
We as a union need to realize that it is this management's goal to make money no matter who flies it. An agreement with KLM like AF could trim the schedule out of AMS significantly.
I personally think that people will truly rear up in revolt when the see the premium wide body jobs getting outsourced. I fear that it is coming sooner than many think.

iceman49

That sort of deal was already in place when NWA and KLM first got together, I would imagine it would continue. I know KLM is upset about what they feel is the "poaching" of Africa traffic. If the UAL/Air Lingus arrangement is allowed I would agree with your statement. Outsource the top and outsource the bottom...not much left.

acl65pilot

That is part of the fear. Yes, NWA had something like this in place, but since AF in effect merged with KLM, our venture will go further than what NWA had. See our deal with AF IMHO is scary. We fly routes they get paid. They fly routes DAL gets money. It is about as close to an international merger as you can get. Now that NWA is DAL, we will change the way we do business with KLM. I hope to god we keep flights like AMS to BOM, but I am not holding my breath. It can be done by KLM and we can share the money. All I am saying is give the movement of their feet, I am concerned.
This is not a UAUA/Air Lingus deal. The flights would still be flown by pilots of one of the airlines represented in the agreement. Kind of like the JFK-CDG route is now. That was the first route, there will be a lot more in the coming years.
As for KLM, and AF having issues with our Africa flying. You are correct. We are taking some of their best customers that used to fly to the US via CDG and AMS. Now they get to go direct. I have been told directly that we have caught a little heat for it. All future flying is being coordinated. Also 12 cities on the African continent by the end of the year, FWIW.

RockyBoy

Can't it go both ways here? What about KLM outsourcing it's flying to Delta. I think we have gotten more flying from the AF deal than we have given them. If things go the way the politicians want, maybe we will all be one airline in a few years anyways and won't have to worry about outsourcing to AF and KLM.

acl65pilot

that would be interesting. To join groups the RLA might have to be nullified. If not it would have its jurisdiction tested on pilots from a foreign country.