Carl Spackler

I guess that's what threw me. The 744 and the 777 have the same mission. Nearly every time it takes off, it is with a crew of 4 - just like the 777. Yet the 744 has 28 pilots per aircraft, compared to the 777 at 35 pilots per aircraft.

"Rounding" up from 3.1 to 4 isn't rounding...it's exaggerating.

Carl

Carl Spackler

Interesting that you would just quote the first sentence of Moak's response, instead of the rest of it. I'll repost the whole answer for you because I wanted you to read just a little further.

Capt Moak: "...Local pilot leaders chart the course of negotiations and - through consensus of their members - make the decisions on priorities. At the national and international level, our highest priority is to help pilot leaders at different carriers visualize favorable contract patterns across the industry and provide the resources to reach a contract that ensures the greater good for the entire profession. Contracts that focus solely on self-interests will inevitably lower the high standards that this union has established for eight decades and in the end hurt all of us."

Carl

Carl Spackler

I'm sure too.

Carl

Pineapple Guy

Carl, I think that is an EXCELLENT national philosophy. What Capt. Moak just said was, "If you, Delta ALPA, sell out scope for higher pay rates then your contract is focused 'solely on self-interests and will inevitably lower the high standards that this union has established for eight decades and in the end hurt all of us.'" How true!

What's not to like about that? By my line of thinking, any contract that increases outsourcing to the lowest bidder violates his objective, and thus he has offered national level resources to ensure the greater good for the entire profession. Anyone who thinks the greater good rests with more outsourcing to the lowest bidder is wrong; and no where in his statement does he indicate that is his purpose. Similarly, any regional contract that tries to undermine a fellow regional is also focused "solely on self-interests and will inevitably lower the high standards that this union has established for eight decades and in the end hurt all of us" and thus, is also, against national ALPA policy.

Carl Spackler

Well I look a little different. As you can see, my love of Japanese food has led to a significant man-boob problem.






Carl

Carl Spackler

I thought you would.

Really? That's what he said? Strange, but I didn't read your quote anywhere in his interview. I'll go read it again.

You have a right to your line of thinking, but you forget that it was Capt. Moak (and his predecessors) that DID allow outsourcing to the lowest bidder. As a matter of fact, Capt. Moak has publicly stated over and over that RJ's are good for Delta Air Lines.

I believe the evidence is clear from Moak's history that what he meant was that any attempt to recapture Scope by the majors will hurt our regional brothers and will be considered "self-interests"...which will be fought by ALPA national with its considerable resources.

Carl

scambo1

PG;

LM cannot help but to be a breath of fresh air leadership-wise from our two previous Nat'l Chairs - two absolute disasters IMO.

You have repeatedly sounded the trumpet that higher payrates are unsustainable at least not C2K (forget COLA).

My guess is you are just trying to counter Carl because he posted one side of the spectrum's opinion.

The truth is, LM's quote was vague enough that it could be taken many ways. The greater good of the profession is certainly difficult to nail down - who's agenda is going to be GREATER in a good way?

Pineapple Guy

Actually, that's not true. What I have said, and still believe, is that absent our fellow pilots doing their part instead of thumping their chests, it is unsustainable for Delta pilots pay rates to be 50+% above the industry average. We can be at the top, even some percentage above the next competitor, but not 50%.

Only the biggest cynic would believe what many here seem to believe: that somehow it is in ALPA National's interest for flying to be transferred from higher wage paying (and dues paying) pilot groups to lower wage (and dues) paying pilot groups. I simply try to counter that illogical argument every time it comes up.

Columbia

OK, no more increased outsourcing as it undermines collective bargaining efforts at the majors. Also, no more undercutting of one another at the regionals in an effort to take flying away from fellow regionals. How about going a bit further? What if CAL/UAL, for example, were to not only stop increased outsourcing, but in fact reduce it or "take it back" to CALs 50-seat level at the expense of their regional partners and subsequently cause many regional pilots to lose jobs? This in turn would give those regionals with looser scope to then undermine the now higher CASM 50-seat UAL/CAL regionals.
In other words, isn't taking it back from the regionals as undermining as giving it out? In SuperSunday terms, a good defense is necessary to stop the advance, however, you need to ultimately advance the ball in the other direction to win. Football isn't a zero sum game.

Too Tall

Question for those with more reserve know how than me, I have a PR partial payback day tomorrow Mon, and I'm on an X day today. That means I'm off until my partial pay back day ends tomorrow at 18:55 then back to long call correct? Thanks in advance.