Dirtdiver

Had a FA tell me a couple years back she gave up 60%. "How's that?" I asked. Couldn't remember anyone coughing up more than us.
"My husband is a FA too, we each gave up 30%, that comes out to 60%"
"So how's the math dept at UGA?"

Dirtdiver

Back to scope, my opinion is that if DL mgt thinks the C series is the right equipment for our markets, buy 'em and we'll fly 'em. Want more 76 seaters? Buy those and we'll fly 'em also.

The restriction only kicks in if someone else is flying them

sailingfun

The flight attendants at Delta took two 10 percent paycuts. The first cut was 10 percent across the board. The second cut was targeted a bit and was not across the board depending on years of service. That took their hourly wage from around 49.70 to just below 40 dollars an hour. In addition they had their work rules slashed to the bone. The work rules were however restored in Jul of 09. There have been 3 pay increases since chapter 11 ended and they are now back to 46.00 dollars an hour.
In addition to the above they pay more for their medical plans and lost a week of vacation much like the pilots. Neither has been restored.
You will on occasion here a flight attendant claim she was making 60 dollars an hour. Thats a bit of a lie. What they are talking about is prior to 2001 the Delta flight attendants were paid a basic flight pay and then a hourly pay for hours flown above the basic. The basic was 2000.00 dollars a month for the first 50 hours or 40.00 dollars an hour. They then received 60 dollars an hour for everything flown above that amount. Sometime around 2001 they went to a blended pay rate which became the 50 dollar an hour rate for all hours flown. I think they based it on the average hours flown per flight attendant being somewhere around 75.00. If you fly less then that the blended rate was a raise, if you flew more it was a pay cut.

sailingfun

Thats not really correct. The flight attendant pay rate prior to Chapter 11 was just under 50 dollars an hour. They took two 10 percent pay cuts and ended up just below 40 an hour. They are back to 46 an hour now.

The 60 dollar rate goes back to pre 2000. Flight attendants at that time were paid a base rate of 2000.00 for the first 50 hours or 40 an hour. They then got 60 an hour for hours flown above 50.00. That was adjusted in 2001 to a one hourly rate for all hours flown. It was set at around 50.00. The blended rate was designed to keep the average flight attendants overall rate exactly the same. If however you were a flight attendant flying high time you took a cut. A low time flying flight attendant saw a raise from the blended rate.

acl65pilot

Now why could they not state that?

JABDIP

My hourly rate went down 33% not to mention other things we lost.

Carl Spackler

Your problem as always is that we DID read your post. As such you've unmasked yourself (yet again) as someone who has some very low opinions of your fellow pilots. You set up a hypothetical that you were sure would show everyone that we all believe that scope sales are still possible at the right price. The subsequent posts have shown you that you're the only one here that believes that so far.

You try so hard to come off as a line guy with normal populist views, but your own words continue to unmask you.

Carl

Carl Spackler

No you don't acl. You have to say this because you've been called out on it. So many of your previous posts say things like: "I educated the senior guys every chance I get." And: "The senior guys get an earful from me regularly..." And "the senior pilots sold scope and the junior pilots to line their own pockets." I cannot imagine how insufferable you must be to fly with if you really do this in the cockpit. You have some things to teach us senior pilots, but you have so much more to learn from us at this stage in your very new career. You'll never learn it because you're too busy "educating" us.

I make them because somebody has to tell you. Your fellow senior crewmembers are probably just trying to get along with you and enhance CRM, so they tolerate your "education" attempts. If we fly together, I will tell you directly that you'll do yourself a favor by closing your mouth and opening your ears for a while.

I did not describe you as an RJ lifer. I described you as a victim of the hatred and vitriol OF the RJ lifers. Those guys are compelled to pass on generational hatred for their own personal shortcomings. They feel it is the only thing they have left. It is up to people like you to get beyond what you've been taught during the very formative years of your aviation career by some truly awful people.

Carl

Launchpad475

Who the heck is Alaska Express? no such thing.

acl65pilot

Never said they would pass the MEMRAT test, just that some pilots freely admit that their only goal is pay, even if there is a trade off. Also look at my posts that state that at best 30% of this group would go for that. My personal opinion is that, it would not make it past the MEC Council much less MEMRAT. Thanks for your spite though. Everything I have posted has come out of the mouths of Captains that have been here over 20 years fwiw.

Not sure what you think my views are, but like you I am not willing to sell scope for pay.

You also fail to see the context of the posts, and the word "education." Many of the guys I fly with have no clue we even have a AS code share, have no clue what the AF/KLM/JV entails, and lastly, see RJ's as RJ's and really give them no thought except that they keep getting bigger. Some do realize that, leverage is leaving the list though, but not as many as I would like to see.

Education is not about what their "views" should be, but about what these sections of the contract mean, and what their implications are. In fact I let them read the contract themselves.


Fine by me Carl, I will be your mute FO and that is oh so good for CRM...

Realistically Carl, I ask them what they want they tell me, and when they say Pay no matter what, I ask them a few questions, ask them what they know about scope, etc. It is hardly an one sided discussion, and is never confrontational, but I know you would never believe that.



Again, I do not know where you get off thinking I am anything of the sort, but I do know you make your assumptions and are stuck to them. The simple fact is that there are some pilots that are "willing" to do whatever it takes to make their pay go up. Not my words theirs. Do I think that it is enough to pass MEMRAT? Nope not at all. I respect their positions on a the issues for one reason, they like you and I are entitled to them. I can disagree, and so can you. It is OK if not everyone shares the same view. That is the job of the MEC. They create a majority position.

Reality Carl is we agree on a great many issues, but take totally different paths to them. We have 12,000+ pilots and all have different priorities and many of them are not the weighted the same as you. I am sorry if that is news to you.