Any "Latest & Greatest" about Delta?
10-28-2010, 04:17 AM
Happy to be here
Joined APC: Jun 2006
Position: A-320A
Posts: 18,563
NWA320, no kidding, we are just a line on the ledger, I mean that. That is also why thorough and in depth analysis is needed. The cost of each item is needed, so we can compare apples to apples.
Restoration will not even be a possibility unless we have a unified group.
Restoration will not even be a possibility unless we have a unified group.
10-28-2010, 04:46 AM
The Brown Dot +1
Joined APC: Jun 2009
Position: 777B
Posts: 7,775
Sad isn't it? I married a French Canadian, they know beauty in France, what the heck happened?
Although Irish... black Irish women are well...
Here is one thing to think about and correct me if I'm wrong but we're locked into long term contracts with regional airlines for airplanes that are deemed unprofitable.
That is a threat no matter where you stand on the rj issue. In a sense, it is a threat to all from the Delta pilots to the RJ lifers its just a matter of how long until it bites you in the posterior or worse.
In house means you dump what you don't want anymore and buy what you do. I don't think it takes a rocket scientist to figure out in business you need to be as flexible and adaptive as you possibly can be.
Although Irish... black Irish women are well...
Here is one thing to think about and correct me if I'm wrong but we're locked into long term contracts with regional airlines for airplanes that are deemed unprofitable.
That is a threat no matter where you stand on the rj issue. In a sense, it is a threat to all from the Delta pilots to the RJ lifers its just a matter of how long until it bites you in the posterior or worse.
In house means you dump what you don't want anymore and buy what you do. I don't think it takes a rocket scientist to figure out in business you need to be as flexible and adaptive as you possibly can be.
Great point FTB!
I commute frequently with an "RJ Lifer" who works for Comair. I'm not commenting on either of those labels. Today he is a senior Captain. In 2 years he will be a junior FO.
He is in serious job hunting mode right now - which is painful for him, it would be for anyone. But my belief is that in a way he is lucky - the writing is on the wall. "Divert early, be the first in line for the gas" applies here.
The RJ lifers at other companies will have the opportuity to do what he is doing sooner or later. If that is the case, isn't sooner better?
10-28-2010, 04:51 AM
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Jun 2008
Posts: 3,716
FtB;
We should not have to pay to bring this flying back. Let a contract expire, and then it returns in house. I do not care if DAL wants to bring the jet over or not. That is there call. I want the "flying" back and in the routes. If DAL wants to stick a C172 on it, great, we will fly it. We can also be pragmatic enough to realize that forcing DAL to cancel these contracts costs money, so we allow them to expire, along with a commitment from DAL for no renewals, extensions, expansion, or new ASA's.
We should not have to pay to bring this flying back. Let a contract expire, and then it returns in house. I do not care if DAL wants to bring the jet over or not. That is there call. I want the "flying" back and in the routes. If DAL wants to stick a C172 on it, great, we will fly it. We can also be pragmatic enough to realize that forcing DAL to cancel these contracts costs money, so we allow them to expire, along with a commitment from DAL for no renewals, extensions, expansion, or new ASA's.
10-28-2010, 05:08 AM
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Nov 2008
Position: A-320/A
Posts: 588
10-28-2010, 05:17 AM
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Feb 2008
Posts: 2,539
October 27, 2010
Delta will suspend regional service in four poorly-performing markets this winter as it streamlines its fleet and reduces less-efficient turboprops and small jet aircraft from the Delta Connection fleet.
Service will end at Lynchburg, Va.; Florence, S.C.; and London, Ontario, on Jan. 4. Seasonal service at Hilton Head, S.C., will be suspended on Monday. No Delta employees will be affected at any of these stations.
The decisions were made in part because Delta is phasing the Saab 340 turboprop out of the regional fleet, and about 50 of the 50-seat CRJ-200 aircraft are being retired this year as well. In addition, revenue and passenger loads in each of the markets had declined significantly this year.
The market suspensions come as Delta focuses on maintaining its capacity discipline and concentrating growth in profitable markets. The airline’s capacity is forecast to grow between 1% and 3% next year.
10-28-2010, 05:18 AM
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Aug 2010
Posts: 2,530
------------
Great point FTB!
I commute frequently with an "RJ Lifer" who works for Comair. I'm not commenting on either of those labels. Today he is a senior Captain. In 2 years he will be a junior FO.
He is in serious job hunting mode right now - which is painful for him, it would be for anyone. But my belief is that in a way he is lucky - the writing is on the wall. "Divert early, be the first in line for the gas" applies here.
The RJ lifers at other companies will have the opportuity to do what he is doing sooner or later. If that is the case, isn't sooner better?
Great point FTB!
I commute frequently with an "RJ Lifer" who works for Comair. I'm not commenting on either of those labels. Today he is a senior Captain. In 2 years he will be a junior FO.
He is in serious job hunting mode right now - which is painful for him, it would be for anyone. But my belief is that in a way he is lucky - the writing is on the wall. "Divert early, be the first in line for the gas" applies here.
The RJ lifers at other companies will have the opportuity to do what he is doing sooner or later. If that is the case, isn't sooner better?
10-28-2010, 05:54 AM
Can't abide NAI
Joined APC: Jun 2007
Position: Douglas Aerospace post production Flight Test & Work Around Engineering bulletin dissembler
Posts: 12,014
ALPA weatherman responsible for rain
October 27, 2010
ALPA was the bargaining agent during rain at four poorly-performing markets this winter ....
"It rained at Lynchburg, Va.; Florence, S.C.; and London, Ontario, on Jan. 4. seasonally at Hilton Head, S.C., said MEC Communications Chair Buzz Lightyear. We were the bargaining agent during these showers."
Fact check dot com reported it is unique for a weatherman to take credit for the weather.
Pilots in Atlanta, Minneapolis, Detroit, Memphis, Los Angeles, Salt Lake City, and Seattle all said they did not care, since none of the rain fell on them. Pilots in Cincinnati could not be reached for comment."
October 27, 2010
ALPA was the bargaining agent during rain at four poorly-performing markets this winter ....
"It rained at Lynchburg, Va.; Florence, S.C.; and London, Ontario, on Jan. 4. seasonally at Hilton Head, S.C., said MEC Communications Chair Buzz Lightyear. We were the bargaining agent during these showers."
Fact check dot com reported it is unique for a weatherman to take credit for the weather.
Pilots in Atlanta, Minneapolis, Detroit, Memphis, Los Angeles, Salt Lake City, and Seattle all said they did not care, since none of the rain fell on them. Pilots in Cincinnati could not be reached for comment."
Sir, we don't measure this game by "you lose, I win." We measure our union by its ability to bring together pilots for the purpose of collective bargaining. We measure our union by the power it has at the table. Proactive engagement and working with management to our mutual benefit is a good thing, but it is not a replacement for a monopoly on their labor supply.
One leading candidate for MEC Chairman told me, and I quote, "Scope does not matter." His opinion is based, like yours, on the fact that economic trends are resulting in management pulling down RJ flying. Therefore we do not need to "invest" in job protection provisions which are not needed.
What scares me is that many completely fail to grasp what this is about. It is about UNITY. It is about a union powerful enough to come to the table and say "we represent pilot labor. You can not operate your airline without us." Every job outsourced makes this statement less and less true.
If scope has no value, then that should cut either way. If it does not matter, the management should not care if we close the loopholes in our contracts as the contracts they permit expire.
Of course it does matter. By minimizing scope's importance it prepares expectations for the next big scope sale. Richard Anderson now publicly draws the line at 100 seats and is talking more about the C Series engine being a games changing tech. Our Company publishes a 100 seat line with no rebuttal from ALPA. We've already outsourced a 122 seat platform that is restricted to an arbitrary seat limit which could easily vanish under economic stress. The C Series waits with no firm orders (except at "regional" airlines) as everyone waits to see who's going to operate the thing. I sit here with a Delta seniority number wondering too.
Of course the biggest storm cloud on the horizon is economic. Can we afford to replace our MD88 and 757 fleet? The 88's life could be extended, but the 757's structural limits are more finite.
Further, if "scope does not matter" then by extrapolation neither do our pilots' jobs. That is a terrible political position. We need to renounce our support for outsourcing in unequivocal terms. Sorry if that ties your hands, but unity is job one in a union.
Last edited by Bucking Bar; 10-28-2010 at 06:08 AM.
10-28-2010, 06:22 AM
Underboob King
Joined APC: May 2005
Position: Guppy Commander
Posts: 4,412
Slow,
Sir, we don't measure this game by "you lose, I win." We measure our union by its ability to bring together pilots for the purpose of collective bargaining. We measure our union by the power it has at the table. Proactive engagement and working with management to our mutual benefit is a good thing, but it is not a replacement for a monopoly on their labor supply.
One leading candidate for MEC Chairman told me, and I quote, "Scope does not matter." His opinion is based, like yours, on the fact that economic trends are resulting in management pulling down RJ flying. Therefore we do not need to "invest" in job protection provisions which are not needed.
What scares me is that many completely fail to grasp what this is about. It is about UNITY. It is about a union powerful enough to come to the table and say "we represent pilot labor. You can not operate your airline without us." Every job outsourced makes this statement less and less true.
If scope has no value, then that should cut either way. If it does not matter, the management should not care if we close the loopholes in our contracts as the contracts they permit expire.
Of course it does matter. By minimizing scope's importance it prepares expectations for the next big scope sale. Richard Anderson now publicly draws the line at 100 seats and is talking more about the C Series engine being a games changing tech. Our Company publishes a 100 seat line with no rebuttal from ALPA. We've already outsourced a 122 seat platform that is restricted to an arbitrary seat limit which could easily vanish under economic stress. The C Series waits with no firm orders (except at "regional" airlines) as everyone waits to see who's going to operate the thing. I sit here with a Delta seniority number wondering too.
Of course the biggest storm cloud on the horizon is economic. Can we afford to replace our MD88 and 757 fleet? The 88's life could be extended, but the 757's structural limits are more finite.
Further, if "scope does not matter" then by extrapolation neither do our pilots' jobs. That is a terrible political position. We need to renounce our support for outsourcing in unequivocal terms. Sorry if that ties your hands, but unity is job one in a union.
Sir, we don't measure this game by "you lose, I win." We measure our union by its ability to bring together pilots for the purpose of collective bargaining. We measure our union by the power it has at the table. Proactive engagement and working with management to our mutual benefit is a good thing, but it is not a replacement for a monopoly on their labor supply.
One leading candidate for MEC Chairman told me, and I quote, "Scope does not matter." His opinion is based, like yours, on the fact that economic trends are resulting in management pulling down RJ flying. Therefore we do not need to "invest" in job protection provisions which are not needed.
What scares me is that many completely fail to grasp what this is about. It is about UNITY. It is about a union powerful enough to come to the table and say "we represent pilot labor. You can not operate your airline without us." Every job outsourced makes this statement less and less true.
If scope has no value, then that should cut either way. If it does not matter, the management should not care if we close the loopholes in our contracts as the contracts they permit expire.
Of course it does matter. By minimizing scope's importance it prepares expectations for the next big scope sale. Richard Anderson now publicly draws the line at 100 seats and is talking more about the C Series engine being a games changing tech. Our Company publishes a 100 seat line with no rebuttal from ALPA. We've already outsourced a 122 seat platform that is restricted to an arbitrary seat limit which could easily vanish under economic stress. The C Series waits with no firm orders (except at "regional" airlines) as everyone waits to see who's going to operate the thing. I sit here with a Delta seniority number wondering too.
Of course the biggest storm cloud on the horizon is economic. Can we afford to replace our MD88 and 757 fleet? The 88's life could be extended, but the 757's structural limits are more finite.
Further, if "scope does not matter" then by extrapolation neither do our pilots' jobs. That is a terrible political position. We need to renounce our support for outsourcing in unequivocal terms. Sorry if that ties your hands, but unity is job one in a union.
10-28-2010, 06:39 AM
No longer cares
Joined APC: Mar 2008
Position: 767er Captain
Posts: 12,109
I understand what he is trying to say here.. and maybe it is a lowered expectation... but i don't want a number that the company will be looking to take away once there is a blip in the economy... that being said, i don't believe that dalpa truly knows what that number is... so we should shoot for the moon.... how's that for a wishy washy post 
10-28-2010, 07:03 AM
Moderator
Joined APC: Oct 2006
Position: B757/767
Posts: 13,088
Slow,
Sir, we don't measure this game by "you lose, I win." We measure our union by its ability to bring together pilots for the purpose of collective bargaining. We measure our union by the power it has at the table. Proactive engagement and working with management to our mutual benefit is a good thing, but it is not a replacement for a monopoly on their labor supply.
One leading candidate for MEC Chairman told me, and I quote, "Scope does not matter." His opinion is based, like yours, on the fact that economic trends are resulting in management pulling down RJ flying. Therefore we do not need to "invest" in job protection provisions which are not needed.
What scares me is that many completely fail to grasp what this is about. It is about UNITY. It is about a union powerful enough to come to the table and say "we represent pilot labor. You can not operate your airline without us." Every job outsourced makes this statement less and less true.
If scope has no value, then that should cut either way. If it does not matter, the management should not care if we close the loopholes in our contracts as the contracts they permit expire.
Of course it does matter. By minimizing scope's importance it prepares expectations for the next big scope sale. Richard Anderson now publicly draws the line at 100 seats and is talking more about the C Series engine being a games changing tech. Our Company publishes a 100 seat line with no rebuttal from ALPA. We've already outsourced a 122 seat platform that is restricted to an arbitrary seat limit which could easily vanish under economic stress. The C Series waits with no firm orders (except at "regional" airlines) as everyone waits to see who's going to operate the thing. I sit here with a Delta seniority number wondering too.
Of course the biggest storm cloud on the horizon is economic. Can we afford to replace our MD88 and 757 fleet? The 88's life could be extended, but the 757's structural limits are more finite.
Further, if "scope does not matter" then by extrapolation neither do our pilots' jobs. That is a terrible political position. We need to renounce our support for outsourcing in unequivocal terms. Sorry if that ties your hands, but unity is job one in a union.
Sir, we don't measure this game by "you lose, I win." We measure our union by its ability to bring together pilots for the purpose of collective bargaining. We measure our union by the power it has at the table. Proactive engagement and working with management to our mutual benefit is a good thing, but it is not a replacement for a monopoly on their labor supply.
One leading candidate for MEC Chairman told me, and I quote, "Scope does not matter." His opinion is based, like yours, on the fact that economic trends are resulting in management pulling down RJ flying. Therefore we do not need to "invest" in job protection provisions which are not needed.
What scares me is that many completely fail to grasp what this is about. It is about UNITY. It is about a union powerful enough to come to the table and say "we represent pilot labor. You can not operate your airline without us." Every job outsourced makes this statement less and less true.
If scope has no value, then that should cut either way. If it does not matter, the management should not care if we close the loopholes in our contracts as the contracts they permit expire.
Of course it does matter. By minimizing scope's importance it prepares expectations for the next big scope sale. Richard Anderson now publicly draws the line at 100 seats and is talking more about the C Series engine being a games changing tech. Our Company publishes a 100 seat line with no rebuttal from ALPA. We've already outsourced a 122 seat platform that is restricted to an arbitrary seat limit which could easily vanish under economic stress. The C Series waits with no firm orders (except at "regional" airlines) as everyone waits to see who's going to operate the thing. I sit here with a Delta seniority number wondering too.
Of course the biggest storm cloud on the horizon is economic. Can we afford to replace our MD88 and 757 fleet? The 88's life could be extended, but the 757's structural limits are more finite.
Further, if "scope does not matter" then by extrapolation neither do our pilots' jobs. That is a terrible political position. We need to renounce our support for outsourcing in unequivocal terms. Sorry if that ties your hands, but unity is job one in a union.
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