johnso29

If they were deferred, and new 777 orders were placed to arrive before them I would think they would be open to ONLY DL(assuming inside the 5 yr fence). I could definitely see management doing that if it were to avoid additional costs. Could that even help avoid additional costs(not directly related to the B787)

Are you dropping another suttle hint?

Opus

Any order change from the original aircraft would fall to the original group that had ordered that aircraft. For example, if Dal management changes the 787 order to 777, as ironic as that would be, it would go to Nwa guys. Likewise, if in some strange order of events they changed their 777 orders to say 787 or even airbuses in some strange exchange then those aircraft go to Dal. Whatever aircraft arrives five years from now are open to all.

forgot to bid

Supposedly DAL wants as many as 45 777s. If in the next 5 years they begin marching towards that number and they convert 787 orders to 777s then isn't it possible they'd have a litigation mess, imho, over who gets to fly them and possibly issues on staffing the airplane. Is the ruling from the board clear enough to prevent it?

If they just make a deal with Boeing, delay 787s and order more 777s then isn't far more clear who gets to fly them and thus fewer to no issues? And then when the fences fall the 787 orders either stay or convert but its open to all by that point.

And I'm sure Boeing has plenty of po'd 787 customers that want the plane now and so if DAL steps out of line then Boeing might be happy anyways.

BoeingTanker

Thanks guys for the information. That helps me a lot.

Ferd149

I would guess that:

a. He is misinformed

b. He is talking about the lack of fences

c. What ACL said........

Seriously, is he senior? There are some senior red guys (old NWAO) who are worried that if they move equipment (ie, A330s with no fences) and there is a system rebid, they won't be able to hold it with their new numbers. Ok, small sample size of guys I've talked to in this boat but.................

As to who gets what with a 787 cancel, this is how arbritrators even out their cash flow. I'm kidding but this was the basis of all the red/green fights over the years. Is it a replacement jet and PNWA guys get them or are they 777 options that are just being excercised and they go to ODelta? Keep those check books handy.

Ferd
yea Ol' NWA

forgot to bid

ACL, are you hearing anymore about bookings for the spring and summer? Has it picked up yet?

NuGuy

Heyas,

Yea, the replacement aircraft isssue is pretty thorny, but I think ACL and others outlined it as well.

More interesting is if the freighters are replaced within 5 years. 330Fs would be covered under the fence, because they are replacing aircraft that are covered under the current fence. OTOH, an order for ordinary pax 330s would not be.

Interesting times...

Nu

CVG767A

My guess is that if the freighters are retired, that means that we're just going to be carrying belly freight. I can't imagine any business plan that includes purchasing or leasing freighters. FWIW, I hope the 747Fs stick around.

Regarding the 777/787 issue, Ferd hit the nail on the head; I'd be surprised if that one doesn't end up in front of the arbitrator.

KC10 FATboy

I was in ATL this week and CA Dickson was there giving a speech about the upcoming AE and the state of the company. An interesting thing he mentioned was a proposal for a fleet modernization plan. He said Delta historically hasn't been very good at this (keeping the fleet modernized). However, they are taking the bull by the horns and proposing a plan to the investors soon (next week???). He didn't get into specifics, but, I will tell you that a two engine airplane similar to the MD-88 and a big four engine airplane was mentioned as being old and outdated. Additionally, he said Delta is still working on the MD-90s.

Finally, he gave what they (the company) feels would be the timeline for SOC. There's been some rumors that it is coming sooner rather than later. But Dickson said that they don't conceive us being able to crossbid until at least Spring of 2010 ... and he said considering that would severaly impact the summer flying, the more realistic date would be fall of 2010.

If anyone has any inside knowledge of whats being proposed, I'd love to hear it. And for those NWA guys who think I'm just stirring the pot again, I'm not. Don't shoot the messenger please. We're all in this together and I look forward to flying with ya'll some day.

Thanks.

-Fatty

Eric Stratton

Why have the majors given up scope? Because it has allowed them to get a bigger contract or take a smaller hit on the concessions. We all know that whipsawing takes place and yet nothing has been done or is being done to stop it.

I've talked to guys at the majors who have told me that if they could get cheaper regional flying that it would help out the company and their contract talks. More over all profits.

I do agree with you that if we don't do something about the regionals that it will just continue to bring all of us down with them.