Scoop

Nu,

Let’s assume everything you guys are saying is true - the North guys took a pay cut, DAL South procedures and policies are terrible, The 747 pay-rate is out of whack etc.

If all of this is true then why did the North guys vote for the joint contract is such a high percentage and the south guys vote for the joint contract at a much lower percentage? Obviously something about the contract appealed to the North side and obviously more guys on the South side were not impressed.

Does any of that change the position we are all in together right now? I would say no - we have a joint contract that should be improved in a lot of areas - lets start working on that.

I am a bit torn on the whole "wining" issue. I do not consider valid criticisms wining, and I encourage every one to be openly critical of perceived shortcomings in the contract, hopefully with recommended improvements, but I must admit I am getting a little tired of hearing about the "pay-cuts" the North guys took. OK you’re taking home less money now - I agree that sucks - now what? I guess I would recommend trying to be more constructive and less inflammatory in any criticisms of our current position - we are all here because both sides agreed to it.

As far as anyone saying get in line with the DAL South guys that would surprise me - there are plenty of South guys who have an ongoing forum joust with the MEC guys on the DALPA forum - in other words there really is no "line" to fall back into. Don't think that 5 or even 10 guys on this forum are a good barometer for the feelings of 12000 or even the 7000 South guys.

Scoop

mynameisjim

There are pilots at CPZ from American, United, Us Airways, ATA, Aloha, Spirit, and I'm sure many others that I've forgotten or haven't met yet. Oh yeah and Midwest and Airtran, too. I forgot the Northwest guys, and the retired Delta guy.

newKnow

Oh my.{edit} I'm surprised it has survived.

I don't think who voted for who or name calling adds anything to the discussion, Waves. Plus, unless something has changed in my absence, you jeopardize the thread.

Scoop

Quick reserve question - I lowered my RAW score by 15 to pick up a specific trip. Now that the trip is over how do I reset my RAW score? It still says "yes" next to lower my RAW score.

Thanks Scoop

Waves

T, I finally found a big enough screwdriver to jog that memory of why the pay disparity between reg and reserve. I haven't read all the posts after our discussion and someone probably already covered it, but this is why. Disclaimer: I'm not necessarily saying I agree with it.

Reserve guys get paid for every day of the month prorated for 30/31 days. So whether they fly a trip or not, they still get paid the reserve guarantee, whereas the line holder gets paid only for trips flown. So if a reserve guy flew the same trips as a line holder side by side for the entire month, and received the same amount for the trip, the reserve guy's pay would be incredibly much higher for not doing anything else at all. Someone with a super computer determined what the average days worked by reserve guys were and then computed an equivalent pay for actually trips flown, to balance out the off days which are paid as well. That's how it works and that's why it's like that.

A lot of guys will remember "Composite Lines," and the pay cut and QOL reduction we took when we gave that up. A composite line was when regular lines and reserve lines could be divided up and traded. So guys would front load up their schedules with high time trips and then pick up a half a reserve line at the end. Results were much higher pay and it triggered many more GS's because guys would time out on the front half and then they were unable to fly the reserve half, yet they still got paid for it. The company and especially schedulers absolutely hated this, and you couldn't really blame them. Still a pay cut though.

Waves

Sorry, it was meant in fun, but I'll try to behave.

acl65pilot

PCS

April

Select NO and then click on the blue wording to the left. (Reduce my raw score by 15 points) It will cycle it and reset your RAW.

LeineLodge

Click on the dropdown box and select NO. Then click "Reduce my RAW score by 15 pts" next to it, and it will change it. You should see something like "Your request has been processed" at the top of the screen. It will take up to a few hours before your RAW score changes on the reserve availability list, thus changing your position in line. I've been told by schedulers though that the change takes place immediately and that the reserve list that we can see isn't live.

If a trip pops up, they run some kind of report that will place everyone in their proper order, taking into account your RAW-15 request on file at the time.

acl65pilot

Well there are plenty of TWA guys there.

Sink r8

I'm not going to requote Dragon's post, but it does give a good perspective on what the North guys are going through. Also adds a little different angle to the discussion...

When I hear the North guys get upset about not using "best practices", I always think "we'll decide what those are together when we're in the same cockpits together". IOW, I don't want to change things to they way they do things "just because": I want to go to whatever third way suits everyone. So I just wish they would be patient.

Then again, it has never occured to me they may not be getting good training on our procedures. Considering the love for memos and CD's, and considering the fact Delta hasn't really trained anyone on anything in years (meaning the real, person-to-person, classroom insturction stuff), I guess I was pretty naive.

So maybe what we have here is a training problem. Before all Delta pilots can sit down and produce the better mouse-trap, maybe it would help if everyone actually was taught the same system. In the meantime, I guess it's no surprise the North guys are confused and want to go "home", where they're comfortable, and they know how to set flaps, thrust, and trim for takeoff...