Any "Latest & Greatest" about Delta?
04-12-2010, 05:51 AM
Happy to be here
Joined APC: Jun 2006
Position: A-320A
Posts: 18,563
Waves; correct you are.
Even our SVP of Ops states that we generate the revenue and "management" sole purpose is to help the front line. His words not mine. He went further to say that he generates no revenue to the bottom line.
That my friends is our job. We make that ticket a reality. We in effect make sure the money stays in our hands and is not issued in a refund.
Even our SVP of Ops states that we generate the revenue and "management" sole purpose is to help the front line. His words not mine. He went further to say that he generates no revenue to the bottom line.
That my friends is our job. We make that ticket a reality. We in effect make sure the money stays in our hands and is not issued in a refund.
04-12-2010, 05:53 AM
Happy to be here
Joined APC: Jun 2006
Position: A-320A
Posts: 18,563
A few posts back someone inquired about how the fleet integration went yesterday. From the front row (I mean jumpseat), I got to observe the growing pains. I think I now understand some of what the pains for the last two years have really been about. Drum roll please – we don’t speak the same language and no one has been brought in to interpret!
I was on my way home out of LGA yesterday and the jumpseat on the bus was the only game in town. Everything was jammed and the non-rev list to ATL was like 60+ strong. Love the bus jumpseat, but while introducing myself to the CA and FO and asking for a ride it came out that I was a DAL-S guy. To which the CA said” Great! Can you help us with these new forms?”
While this was going on, two more bus CAs came up and started asking questions and before you know it we were holding ‘class’ (using the term very loosely based on my very junior status). The CAs told the agents we would probably be late and her response was everything on the PMNWA aircraft had run late and even the venerable DC9 had gone out 45 late.
Anyway, got to the cockpit and the FO has reams of paperwork on her lap telling her how to dumb down the bus to the WDR info. There was only one release and I had to point out the FOs best friend block and the plethora of information therein. So much of their automation had been disabled, they were feeling totally uncomfortable. We went over the AWABs, discussed the preface and the corrections contained therein and then the real kicker – for our departure it was calling for a flex (derate) and flaps 3 with packs on. According to the very senior captain, they never take off flaps 3 with the packs on and therefore can’t use a derate. Long call to the special help line ensues and after finally getting an airbus guy we do what it asks for. We push only 30 minutes late and I was getting asked questions the whole time.
They had tons of stuff to read through but what the CA said really rang true. He called this “training by MEMO”. I couldn’t agree more. What we did here should not be tolerated at any level; let alone the world’s Greatest Air Line.
The lessons in the book /pamphlet were great but until you have an opportunity to put in real numbers they don’t mean much and when it uses terms you don’t understand who do you ask? The help line was OK but would it have hurt to have a couple of us lowly reserve pilots fly around the system to help out for the day? All it took was a little bit of listening and then translating one to another. We on the south side seem much less regimented, but our friends to the north explained that they have gotten incredibly regimented over the years. So what makes sense to us doesn’t to them and we need to help as much as possible!!!
I learned a ton about the Northern guys/gals and have immense respect for what they have had to endure. I’m tired of the constant battle about who got hosed more in the merger. It’s over, get on with it and make sure we’re compensated next contract. Let’s face it, without us, the merger wouldn’t have happened.
I was on my way home out of LGA yesterday and the jumpseat on the bus was the only game in town. Everything was jammed and the non-rev list to ATL was like 60+ strong. Love the bus jumpseat, but while introducing myself to the CA and FO and asking for a ride it came out that I was a DAL-S guy. To which the CA said” Great! Can you help us with these new forms?”
While this was going on, two more bus CAs came up and started asking questions and before you know it we were holding ‘class’ (using the term very loosely based on my very junior status). The CAs told the agents we would probably be late and her response was everything on the PMNWA aircraft had run late and even the venerable DC9 had gone out 45 late.
Anyway, got to the cockpit and the FO has reams of paperwork on her lap telling her how to dumb down the bus to the WDR info. There was only one release and I had to point out the FOs best friend block and the plethora of information therein. So much of their automation had been disabled, they were feeling totally uncomfortable. We went over the AWABs, discussed the preface and the corrections contained therein and then the real kicker – for our departure it was calling for a flex (derate) and flaps 3 with packs on. According to the very senior captain, they never take off flaps 3 with the packs on and therefore can’t use a derate. Long call to the special help line ensues and after finally getting an airbus guy we do what it asks for. We push only 30 minutes late and I was getting asked questions the whole time.
They had tons of stuff to read through but what the CA said really rang true. He called this “training by MEMO”. I couldn’t agree more. What we did here should not be tolerated at any level; let alone the world’s Greatest Air Line.
The lessons in the book /pamphlet were great but until you have an opportunity to put in real numbers they don’t mean much and when it uses terms you don’t understand who do you ask? The help line was OK but would it have hurt to have a couple of us lowly reserve pilots fly around the system to help out for the day? All it took was a little bit of listening and then translating one to another. We on the south side seem much less regimented, but our friends to the north explained that they have gotten incredibly regimented over the years. So what makes sense to us doesn’t to them and we need to help as much as possible!!!
I learned a ton about the Northern guys/gals and have immense respect for what they have had to endure. I’m tired of the constant battle about who got hosed more in the merger. It’s over, get on with it and make sure we’re compensated next contract. Let’s face it, without us, the merger wouldn’t have happened.
04-12-2010, 05:55 AM
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Apr 2005
Position: 767ER capt
Posts: 1,190
"Don't sell yourself short; you're a terrific slouch."
04-12-2010, 06:04 AM
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Apr 2009
Posts: 710
A few posts back someone inquired about how the fleet integration went yesterday. From the front row (I mean jumpseat), I got to observe the growing pains. I think I now understand some of what the pains for the last two years have really been about. Drum roll please – we don’t speak the same language and no one has been brought in to interpret!
I was on my way home out of LGA yesterday and the jumpseat on the bus was the only game in town. Everything was jammed and the non-rev list to ATL was like 60+ strong. Love the bus jumpseat, but while introducing myself to the CA and FO and asking for a ride it came out that I was a DAL-S guy. To which the CA said” Great! Can you help us with these new forms?”
While this was going on, two more bus CAs came up and started asking questions and before you know it we were holding ‘class’ (using the term very loosely based on my very junior status). The CAs told the agents we would probably be late and her response was everything on the PMNWA aircraft had run late and even the venerable DC9 had gone out 45 late.
Anyway, got to the cockpit and the FO has reams of paperwork on her lap telling her how to dumb down the bus to the WDR info. There was only one release and I had to point out the FOs best friend block and the plethora of information therein. So much of their automation had been disabled, they were feeling totally uncomfortable. We went over the AWABs, discussed the preface and the corrections contained therein and then the real kicker – for our departure it was calling for a flex (derate) and flaps 3 with packs on. According to the very senior captain, they never take off flaps 3 with the packs on and therefore can’t use a derate. Long call to the special help line ensues and after finally getting an airbus guy we do what it asks for. We push only 30 minutes late and I was getting asked questions the whole time.
They had tons of stuff to read through but what the CA said really rang true. He called this “training by MEMO”. I couldn’t agree more. What we did here should not be tolerated at any level; let alone the world’s Greatest Air Line.
The lessons in the book /pamphlet were great but until you have an opportunity to put in real numbers they don’t mean much and when it uses terms you don’t understand who do you ask? The help line was OK but would it have hurt to have a couple of us lowly reserve pilots fly around the system to help out for the day? All it took was a little bit of listening and then translating one to another. We on the south side seem much less regimented, but our friends to the north explained that they have gotten incredibly regimented over the years. So what makes sense to us doesn’t to them and we need to help as much as possible!!!
I learned a ton about the Northern guys/gals and have immense respect for what they have had to endure. I’m tired of the constant battle about who got hosed more in the merger. It’s over, get on with it and make sure we’re compensated next contract. Let’s face it, without us, the merger wouldn’t have happened.
I was on my way home out of LGA yesterday and the jumpseat on the bus was the only game in town. Everything was jammed and the non-rev list to ATL was like 60+ strong. Love the bus jumpseat, but while introducing myself to the CA and FO and asking for a ride it came out that I was a DAL-S guy. To which the CA said” Great! Can you help us with these new forms?”
While this was going on, two more bus CAs came up and started asking questions and before you know it we were holding ‘class’ (using the term very loosely based on my very junior status). The CAs told the agents we would probably be late and her response was everything on the PMNWA aircraft had run late and even the venerable DC9 had gone out 45 late.
Anyway, got to the cockpit and the FO has reams of paperwork on her lap telling her how to dumb down the bus to the WDR info. There was only one release and I had to point out the FOs best friend block and the plethora of information therein. So much of their automation had been disabled, they were feeling totally uncomfortable. We went over the AWABs, discussed the preface and the corrections contained therein and then the real kicker – for our departure it was calling for a flex (derate) and flaps 3 with packs on. According to the very senior captain, they never take off flaps 3 with the packs on and therefore can’t use a derate. Long call to the special help line ensues and after finally getting an airbus guy we do what it asks for. We push only 30 minutes late and I was getting asked questions the whole time.
They had tons of stuff to read through but what the CA said really rang true. He called this “training by MEMO”. I couldn’t agree more. What we did here should not be tolerated at any level; let alone the world’s Greatest Air Line.
The lessons in the book /pamphlet were great but until you have an opportunity to put in real numbers they don’t mean much and when it uses terms you don’t understand who do you ask? The help line was OK but would it have hurt to have a couple of us lowly reserve pilots fly around the system to help out for the day? All it took was a little bit of listening and then translating one to another. We on the south side seem much less regimented, but our friends to the north explained that they have gotten incredibly regimented over the years. So what makes sense to us doesn’t to them and we need to help as much as possible!!!
I learned a ton about the Northern guys/gals and have immense respect for what they have had to endure. I’m tired of the constant battle about who got hosed more in the merger. It’s over, get on with it and make sure we’re compensated next contract. Let’s face it, without us, the merger wouldn’t have happened.
The fact of the matter is that the "World's Greatest Airline" will be defined by the lowest cost structure with code share contract language in the industry being interpreted loosely at best. Unfortunately, that is exactly what it takes to make it in today's market. Contrasting our train by memo or train by CBT to American's 2 on 1 approach to training is the epitome of LCC vs Legacy. If anyone thinks the Latest and Greatest is still a Legacy carrier, you are greatly mistaken. That being said, if I had to buy airline stock, it would be that of a LCC, not a traditional legacy.
04-12-2010, 06:07 AM
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Apr 2009
Posts: 710
Think so, give the keys to an RJ (CPZ) pilot. He'll fly it first and ask for a contract / payscale after you and I hit the street.
04-12-2010, 06:10 AM
Looking for a laugh
Joined APC: Feb 2008
Posts: 4,099
– we don’t speak the same language and no one has been brought in to interpret!
We on the south side seem much less regimented, but our friends to the north explained that they have gotten incredibly regimented over the years. So what makes sense to us doesn’t to them and we need to help as much as possible!!!
We on the south side seem much less regimented, but our friends to the north explained that they have gotten incredibly regimented over the years. So what makes sense to us doesn’t to them and we need to help as much as possible!!!
The fDALs have a more "DYI" approach to training and operating, while the fNWAs was more structured. Nothing wrong with either way, but over time, I think we will see a melding of the two ways.
For the record, if I had to digest all the changes that the north guys had to, while listening to, "Just get over it," I'd be PO'd too.
04-12-2010, 06:12 AM
Happy to be here
Joined APC: Jun 2006
Position: A-320A
Posts: 18,563
It general terms you are correct since the regional guy wants to be where we are but does not want to reset their seniority. We have beaten this horse many times, but getting rid of that seniority rest is the quickest way to stop this desire.
04-12-2010, 06:13 AM
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Feb 2008
Position: 777 Sim Instructor
Posts: 745
OK.. maybe I was a bit harsh. but whenever I hear.. see..the term windfall from a senior guy when it relates to more junior guys getting some sort of improvements in "pay" it gets under my saddle blanket. And one thing I was afraid of in this argument came to fruition. I have ALWAYS complained about the current reserve system, even when I was a line holder. It sucked then.. and it sucks still. It just happens to be a bit more personal now. Reserve is the only thing we do that ignores seniority... (bring it slowplay and alfa, there's no way you can defend this one.) But a little more from my perspective. I just think it's wrong that a regular line guy can fly a 2 day trip for 10+ hours and a reserve guy cen fly the exact same trip for 5. No way that can be justified.
ahhhh I'll let this go.. the same way I did Kiffin. (I do hope that USC gets the death penalty under his watch though).
Oh.. and one last thing for you SEC fans to think about. There are now TWO departures in ATL that are named for UT coaches... Summit and Dooley. bwaaaaa haaaaaa haaaaaaa
GO VOLS
ahhhh I'll let this go.. the same way I did Kiffin. (I do hope that USC gets the death penalty under his watch though
). Oh.. and one last thing for you SEC fans to think about. There are now TWO departures in ATL that are named for UT coaches... Summit and Dooley. bwaaaaa haaaaaa haaaaaaa
GO VOLS
04-12-2010, 06:36 AM
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Mar 2010
Position: SLC 767ER Captain
Posts: 602
Wrong again Shiz. Management doesn't generate squat. Management determines how "WE" generate revenue. You have it completely backwards, or you voted for Obama. Our government doesn't generate squat either, but they govern how we do. With your pay ideas and your ideas that management produces all the revenue, you must be a socialist. Seriously, I'm starting to wonder about you my friend. Sorry, but I'm no longer buying the rounds, you'll have to tax the 747/777 Captains with a beer tax to supplement the junior guys.
04-12-2010, 06:40 AM
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Apr 2009
Posts: 710
I do not know if I would characterize CPZ pilots that way. Most are former major airline drivers.
It general terms you are correct since the regional guy wants to be where we are but does not want to reset their seniority. We have beaten this horse many times, but getting rid of that seniority rest is the quickest way to stop this desire.
It general terms you are correct since the regional guy wants to be where we are but does not want to reset their seniority. We have beaten this horse many times, but getting rid of that seniority rest is the quickest way to stop this desire.
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