Any "Latest & Greatest" about Delta?
04-11-2010, 06:49 AM
veut gagner à la loterie
Joined APC: Apr 2008
Position: Light Chop
Posts: 23,286
, but to date nothing I've read from a DALN pilot on this forum approaches the vitriol directed at "the Delta way" or "Mecca" that I heard out of some NYC ER crews when I was based up there pre-merger. I think if DALS = pre-merger DAL pilots in Atlanta, DALSN can equal NYC, whose pilots do not lack for opinions and may the force be with you if you run into a Pan Am FA, blah blah blah blah blah.
Hopefully those operational things that have people shaking their heads from both sides will be improved to match all those other things done right.
04-11-2010, 07:01 AM
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Mar 2010
Position: SLC 767ER Captain
Posts: 602
Waves,
It is hard for you to realize the losses of the N side because you have not experienced any of the losses that we did with our contract going away. Some things are QOL items that are difficult to put a dollar value on. Did we get a pay raise?? Yes, if you look only at hourly rates. That is very simple. But lets look at W-2s
2008 w-2 :$134,741.06 days worked 99 total 1361$/day
2009 w-2 :$133,934.12 days worked 134 total 1000$/day
2010 w-2 :$140,125.00 days worked 132 total 1061$/day base on avg
for 01/02
So on w-2s alone I made less in 09(DALrates) than in 08(NWA rates) with the huge huge huge pay raise that I got. In the SLI postings we were told time and time again about our huge pay raises that we were getting(go check them out on the old merger page). I said that the numbers did not show that and was told I was totally wrong. And how about that $PER DAY FIGURE
That equates to huge quality of life losses. Lost 2000 hours of sick pay: approx $270,000.00 for me. I was planning on bailing out early but lost medical coverage for early goers so I gotta stick around now. And I can keep going on things that were lost. I am grateful for the raises in pay that were achieved, but had you not got them where would we have been??? Pretty much they just kept us even with where we were. I hope this puts this issue to bed and I for one am sick and tired of it. The above numbers are facts and I got paperwork to back them up. I flew the same time pretty much every month approx 76-77 hours on average. So while it is so easy for you to make your statements where are your facts? So when you tell me that I got a huge pay raise, and I look at the above numbers, it kinda really ticks me off. If that's your goal keep it up you are doing a fine job.
And for the really big one, I would have finished up as capt on the 330 with the last couple years on the 747. It will take a small miracle for me just to get on the 330 after SLI, and I sure did not want to do it on reserve. The only hope is that we grow and expand??????
So, there is a perspective from a N-guy. Most of us are not really happy about this merger. Has nothing to do with N vs S guys on a personal level. I tell my self "that's life" and try to get on with things and hope for the best. I can't speak for the rest of the guys on their w-2s those are just mine. It seems as though you think this merger was a bed of roses for us, but for us there are lots of thorns in that bed. Maybe now you understand us a little more.
P.S. THis post is to be considered informative only and is not meant to further this argument. I would like to put this dog(huge pay raise) to bed and let it lie. You never wake an old dog asleep on the porch. I am done with it.
It is hard for you to realize the losses of the N side because you have not experienced any of the losses that we did with our contract going away. Some things are QOL items that are difficult to put a dollar value on. Did we get a pay raise?? Yes, if you look only at hourly rates. That is very simple. But lets look at W-2s
2008 w-2 :$134,741.06 days worked 99 total 1361$/day
2009 w-2 :$133,934.12 days worked 134 total 1000$/day
2010 w-2 :$140,125.00 days worked 132 total 1061$/day base on avg
for 01/02
So on w-2s alone I made less in 09(DALrates) than in 08(NWA rates) with the huge huge huge pay raise that I got. In the SLI postings we were told time and time again about our huge pay raises that we were getting(go check them out on the old merger page). I said that the numbers did not show that and was told I was totally wrong. And how about that $PER DAY FIGURE
That equates to huge quality of life losses. Lost 2000 hours of sick pay: approx $270,000.00 for me. I was planning on bailing out early but lost medical coverage for early goers so I gotta stick around now. And I can keep going on things that were lost. I am grateful for the raises in pay that were achieved, but had you not got them where would we have been??? Pretty much they just kept us even with where we were. I hope this puts this issue to bed and I for one am sick and tired of it. The above numbers are facts and I got paperwork to back them up. I flew the same time pretty much every month approx 76-77 hours on average. So while it is so easy for you to make your statements where are your facts? So when you tell me that I got a huge pay raise, and I look at the above numbers, it kinda really ticks me off. If that's your goal keep it up you are doing a fine job.
And for the really big one, I would have finished up as capt on the 330 with the last couple years on the 747. It will take a small miracle for me just to get on the 330 after SLI, and I sure did not want to do it on reserve. The only hope is that we grow and expand??????
So, there is a perspective from a N-guy. Most of us are not really happy about this merger. Has nothing to do with N vs S guys on a personal level. I tell my self "that's life" and try to get on with things and hope for the best. I can't speak for the rest of the guys on their w-2s those are just mine. It seems as though you think this merger was a bed of roses for us, but for us there are lots of thorns in that bed. Maybe now you understand us a little more.
P.S. THis post is to be considered informative only and is not meant to further this argument. I would like to put this dog(huge pay raise) to bed and let it lie. You never wake an old dog asleep on the porch. I am done with it.
[FONT='Verdana','sans-serif']Waves,
It is hard for you to realize the losses of the N side because you have not experienced any of the losses that we did with our contract going away. [/FONT][FONT='Verdana','sans-serif']True, I still don’t truly understand. [/FONT]
[FONT='Verdana','sans-serif']Some things are QOL items that are difficult to put a dollar value on. Did we get a pay raise?? Yes, if you look only at hourly rates. That is very simple. But lets look at W-2s
2008 w-2 :$134,741.06 days worked 99 total 1361$/day
2009 w-2 :$133,934.12 days worked 134 total 1000$/day
2010 w-2 :$140,125.00 days worked 132 total 1061$/day base on avg
for 01/02
So on w-2s alone I made less in 09(DALrates) than in 08(NWA rates) with the huge huge huge pay raise that I got. In the SLI postings we were told time and time again about our huge pay raises that we were getting(go check them out on the old merger page). I said that the numbers did not show that and was told I was totally wrong. And how about that $PER DAY FIGURE [/FONT][FONT='Verdana','sans-serif']I guess I still don’t understand this one either. If you work the same amount of hours at a higher rate, how is it you make less money? Keep in mind that ALL airlines have reduced capacity and hours flown. So hours flown at NWA’s would most likely have been less as well.[/FONT]
[FONT='Verdana','sans-serif']
That equates to huge quality of life losses. Lost 2000 hours of sick pay: approx $270,000.00 for me. [/FONT]As I said before, I concede on this issue.[/FONT]
[FONT='Verdana','sans-serif']I was planning on bailing out early but lost medical coverage for early goers so I gotta stick around now. And I can keep going on things that were lost. I am grateful for the raises in pay that were achieved, but had you not got them where would we have been??? Pretty much they just kept us even with where we were. I hope this puts this issue to bed and I for one am sick and tired of it. The above numbers are facts and I got paperwork to back them up. I flew the same time pretty much every month approx 76-77 hours on average. So while it is so easy for you to make your statements where are your facts? So when you tell me that I got a huge pay raise, and I look at the above numbers, it kinda really ticks me off. If that's your goal keep it up you are doing a fine job. [/FONT][FONT='Verdana','sans-serif']Again, truly I don’t mean to tick you off. I just don’t get it YET. I will say that your 76-77 average per month strengthens the mediators position that your 1.5X over 80 hours was only a tiny fraction of what was flown; however, I’m thinking a lot about that system and could be easily convinced of its merit, especially if it were based on 78 hours instead of 80.
[/FONT][FONT='Verdana','sans-serif']
And for the really big one, I would have finished up as capt on the 330 with the last couple years on the 747. It will take a small miracle for me just to get on the 330 after SLI, and I sure did not want to do it on reserve. The only hope is that we grow and expand?????? [/FONT][FONT='Verdana','sans-serif']Yeah, I want to fly it too, but I’ll never see it either. Of course that is not your point.[/FONT][FONT='Verdana','sans-serif']Remember, the merger created a seniority list of jobs brought to the table. Those jobs were also based on 18 787’s which we may never see and NWA’s may never have seen. Instead, our 777’s are still rolling in. It ain’t no 747, but if you would have been a 747 Captain, you should at least be able to fly the 777, which incidentally pays the same. That’s a pretty good consolation I would say. I don’t know why the merger lowered your expectations. When I crunched the numbers, I came out in nearly the EXACT same percentile, as did all my friends. [FONT='Verdana','sans-serif']Which means, I didn’t move at all, and you shouldn’t have either. [/FONT]So it sounds to me like a self induced pity party. Ha
[/FONT][FONT='Verdana','sans-serif']
So, there is a perspective from a N-guy. Most of us are not really happy about this merger. Has nothing to do with N vs S guys on a personal level. I tell my self "that's life" and try to get on with things and hope for the best. I can't speak for the rest of the guys on their w-2s those are just mine. It seems as though you think this merger was a bed of roses for us, but for us there are lots of thorns in that bed. Maybe now you understand us a little more. [/FONT][FONT='Verdana','sans-serif']Hold on their Hoss. I never expressed that this was a bed of roses. That couldn’t be further from the truth. I have stated several times that I have sympathy for all the life altering difficult changes DAL N has and is going through. Please don’t toss that grenade this way, cause I’ll hand it right back. Ha
[/FONT][FONT='Verdana','sans-serif']
P.S. THis post is to be considered informative only and is not meant to further this argument. I would like to put this dog(huge pay raise) to bed and let it lie. You never wake an old dog asleep on the porch. I am done with it. Please don’t be done with it until I figure this thing out.[/FONT][/COLOR]
04-11-2010, 07:07 AM
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Sep 2005
Position: 320B
Posts: 511
Waves, equal, one good, one bad, it really is water under the bridge.
We are integrated, operationally, contractually, and seniority wise. What was is in the past, and the sooner we stop laying our Johnson's out on the table the sooner we will be able to move forward and create unity with in turn will create leverage. 12200 pilots is a big stick.
The time to argue the finer points of which carrier had what was during the SLI talks. That is arbitrated and settled. Anyone who still thinks there is anything to gain by reliving it, please prove it. IMHO, it solves nothing except to be divisive.
We are integrated, operationally, contractually, and seniority wise. What was is in the past, and the sooner we stop laying our Johnson's out on the table the sooner we will be able to move forward and create unity with in turn will create leverage. 12200 pilots is a big stick.
The time to argue the finer points of which carrier had what was during the SLI talks. That is arbitrated and settled. Anyone who still thinks there is anything to gain by reliving it, please prove it. IMHO, it solves nothing except to be divisive.
ACL and all, it seems better on the line..... Finishing OE on the Bus today. Everyone at the training center was great. Showed up in my new base a few days ago and guys were stumbling over each other to say hello and introduce themselves to the new Delta South guy. Everyone has been really outgoing and accommodating.
I'm sure that I'll fly with a guy every now and then that might be dis-gruntled, but that happened prior to the merger. He's got one leg to ***** up a storm..... I'll listen, but after that, I just want to press on, get the job done and have a good trip. I think most of us "Line Dogs" are that way. I've already had the discussion with a couple of guys that I want to hear everyones story, but at the end of the day it doesn't matter to me if I'm flying with a "Red Book", "Green Book" or Delta South guy...... Just want to get the job done safely and enjoy my rotation.
Now, let's look forward....... 2012
04-11-2010, 07:09 AM
veut gagner à la loterie
Joined APC: Apr 2008
Position: Light Chop
Posts: 23,286
Tomcat Is Back!!!!
04-11-2010, 07:10 AM
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Feb 2009
Posts: 841
GENTLEMEN Just a Sunday morning thought but if we do not get LGA/JFK/GUM and others things moving or done alot of us may be in deep doo doo.
04-11-2010, 07:12 AM
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Mar 2010
Position: SLC 767ER Captain
Posts: 602
Waves, equal, one good, one bad, it really is water under the bridge.
We are integrated, operationally, contractually, and seniority wise. What was is in the past, and the sooner we stop laying our Johnson's out on the table the sooner we will be able to move forward and create unity with in turn will create leverage. 12200 pilots is a big stick.
The time to argue the finer points of which carrier had what was during the SLI talks. That is arbitrated and settled. Anyone who still thinks there is anything to gain by reliving it, please prove it. IMHO, it solves nothing except to be divisive.
We are integrated, operationally, contractually, and seniority wise. What was is in the past, and the sooner we stop laying our Johnson's out on the table the sooner we will be able to move forward and create unity with in turn will create leverage. 12200 pilots is a big stick.
The time to argue the finer points of which carrier had what was during the SLI talks. That is arbitrated and settled. Anyone who still thinks there is anything to gain by reliving it, please prove it. IMHO, it solves nothing except to be divisive.
P.S. How does one do those boxed quotes where you highlight a specific area of someones comment and then reply to each area separately? Thanks Waves.
04-11-2010, 07:12 AM
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Jan 2007
Posts: 418
04-11-2010, 07:15 AM
veut gagner à la loterie
Joined APC: Apr 2008
Position: Light Chop
Posts: 23,286
To honor New's request and in honor of Tomcats post below...
I present to you guys the power to do something never granted to everyone on this thread before.
I present to you the source of photos fit to print, CNNSI Cheerleader of the Week. Cheerleaders photos - Sports Illustrated photo galleries - SI.com
Be good.
And here is one for Super: Cheerleader of the Week - Photos - SI.com
I'm Here!!!!
ACL and all, it seems better on the line..... Finishing OE on the Bus today. Everyone at the training center was great. Showed up in my new base a few days ago and guys were stumbling over each other to say hello and introduce themselves to the new Delta South guy. Everyone has been really outgoing and accommodating.
I'm sure that I'll fly with a guy every now and then that might be dis-gruntled, but that happened prior to the merger. He's got one leg to ***** up a storm..... I'll listen, but after that, I just want to press on, get the job done and have a good trip. I think most of us "Line Dogs" are that way. I've already had the discussion with a couple of guys that I want to hear everyones story, but at the end of the day it doesn't matter to me if I'm flying with a "Red Book", "Green Book" or Delta South guy...... Just want to get the job done safely and enjoy my rotation.
Now, let's look forward....... 2012
ACL and all, it seems better on the line..... Finishing OE on the Bus today. Everyone at the training center was great. Showed up in my new base a few days ago and guys were stumbling over each other to say hello and introduce themselves to the new Delta South guy. Everyone has been really outgoing and accommodating.
I'm sure that I'll fly with a guy every now and then that might be dis-gruntled, but that happened prior to the merger. He's got one leg to ***** up a storm..... I'll listen, but after that, I just want to press on, get the job done and have a good trip. I think most of us "Line Dogs" are that way. I've already had the discussion with a couple of guys that I want to hear everyones story, but at the end of the day it doesn't matter to me if I'm flying with a "Red Book", "Green Book" or Delta South guy...... Just want to get the job done safely and enjoy my rotation.
Now, let's look forward....... 2012
I present to you the source of photos fit to print, CNNSI Cheerleader of the Week. Cheerleaders photos - Sports Illustrated photo galleries - SI.com
Be good.
And here is one for Super: Cheerleader of the Week - Photos - SI.com
04-11-2010, 07:16 AM
veut gagner à la loterie
Joined APC: Apr 2008
Position: Light Chop
Posts: 23,286
04-11-2010, 07:27 AM
Sho me da money!
Joined APC: Feb 2007
Position: B25, Left
Posts: 947
"let's help each other out!"
Yesterday while flying out of Atlanta, I have to say my uneasiness about becoming a reluctant transcon commuter was realized in a big way. Captain of the flight had a hall from A1 gate to E1 gate for a 46 minute turn and although I had everything ready to go the gate agent would not allow 9 passengers and 3 non-revs on to the aircraft because it was with in 5 minutes of departure. The big deal was that one of the people waiting for the gate agent to come to his senses was the Captain of the flight!
All in all when the gate agent decided to listen for just a moment everyone was boarded and we left only 7 minutes late.
So I ask all of my flying peers to help out all of us employees, pilots commuting, employee families taking that one vacation together or for crying out loud the passenger paying our salaries, by checking with the gate and even walking the boarding area to see if anyone will be left behind because of the OT zero debacle (and gate agents feeling they control the jumpseat). I know we cant always get everyone on but sometimes the guy with 4 stripes or even 3 stripes can do a lot to get everyone on board.
Sorry to rant but asking for help from the guys and gals flying the line seems to be better than having high blood pressure and being angry....
Thanks again for looking out for one another especially when more than a few of us are now forced to commute......
BTW we did make phone calls about this particular incident and it met with less than confident results. But we are not done making calls either..
Thanks
All in all when the gate agent decided to listen for just a moment everyone was boarded and we left only 7 minutes late.
So I ask all of my flying peers to help out all of us employees, pilots commuting, employee families taking that one vacation together or for crying out loud the passenger paying our salaries, by checking with the gate and even walking the boarding area to see if anyone will be left behind because of the OT zero debacle (and gate agents feeling they control the jumpseat). I know we cant always get everyone on but sometimes the guy with 4 stripes or even 3 stripes can do a lot to get everyone on board.
Sorry to rant but asking for help from the guys and gals flying the line seems to be better than having high blood pressure and being angry....
Thanks again for looking out for one another especially when more than a few of us are now forced to commute......
BTW we did make phone calls about this particular incident and it met with less than confident results. But we are not done making calls either..
Thanks
Thread
Thread Starter
Forum
Replies
Last Post
