Originally Posted by KC10 FATboy

I think the first major airline that announces they'll no longer use subcontractors (regional carriers) to farm out feed under shady contracts ... and publicizes it in a huge fancy campaign blitz will be a big winner in this industry.

tag line ... "At XYZ Airlines, we don't believe in farming out your safety to the subcontractor with the lowest bid, who pays the cheapest wages, and hires the least qualified aircrew and mechanics. Instead, we've taken a new approach. We've decided to bring all of the flying back in house under our control, applying the same stringent rules and requirements for any XYZ flight. blah blah blah

I think it would cause the other majors to react accordingly.

Am I nuts?

Originally Posted by Bucking Bar

Respectfully, your heart is in the right place, but we have not been provided with the numbers, which ALPA resists talking about more than a Florida Senator resists talking about cuts to entitlement programs.

By anecdote, CRJ 200 LCA are making MUCH more than Delta's MD88 LCA's. I would have made 20K more at ASA last year than I did on the 767. Maybe right seat / left seat is an apples and oranges comparison, but, wide body right seats have gone senior to narrow body left seats in some instances here at mainline. Our costs for under wing support, fuel, dispatch, maintenance and financing are in many cases identical (and are in many cases the same people).

Although a couple of months old, a credible calculation put the remaining value of DCI contracts at around $26 Billion dollars. Mesa (which was supposed to have the weakest contract and is in bankruptcy ) was able to enforce their contract to the point that Delta lacked the ability to cancel a Mesa flight to manage slots without being in breach.

This loss of Delta's life blood restricts the Company's ability to manage its network, pay down debt and invest in the future.

I wish ALPA would come clean in its rhetoric about outsourcing. Go ahead and go on record with "outsourcing is good" or "we don't want B scale on the property" something other than this gray "we don't feel it is economically vaible" or "Comair pilots will get date of hire" garbage.

If the outsourcing/widebody/everything for me contingent is confident of their position, let us do a study and see their numbers. Let objective data settle the dispute.

Of course the issue of unity should rise above the financial incentive of outsourcing a junior Delta pilot's job. We should recapture our flying anyway, not just because it is the smart thing to do, but also because it is the right thing to do.

We are holding the line (and I'm thankful for that). But my concern is that when the C Series, or some other paradigm shifting jet comes along Delta will honestly say "we can't afford that, but Skywest can."

Originally Posted by acl65pilot

It really is not a "B-scale" either. It is compensation at a viable rate. A B-scale would be separate rates for performing the same job in the same seat as someone hired before you. What we are suggesting is not that.

Originally Posted by capncrunch

Commuting is not a choice for some. Peoples families and their spouses jobs do not move like management moves aircraft and doles out displacements. Yanking the kids out of school and finding a new job for the wife is not easily done.

Originally Posted by acl65pilot

Duh.

We have talked about this Bar. the CASM for the CS-100 is very close to that of the CRJ-900. To the point that there may be no ROI. IMO, I still think that it will be a great platform once they get the kinks worked out. The GTF seems to be working above spec, and that is a good thing. If will be the interim future of powered flight.

Bar, like I have said before, we as an association cannot claim ignorance like we could in years past in regards to scope. We know have direct proof on the effects of scope. If we sell the 100 seat jet for any darn reason you can think of, we are to blame.

I agree that no one wants a B-Scale here at DAL, or at least that is what I am gathering, but as I have posted before, a payrate that makes a 70+ seat jet a viable mainline jet will provide seniority, longevity and a direct line to a 777A seat. It is better than the resetting of longevity that is the current regional/mainline setup.
It really is not a "B-scale" either. It is compensation at a viable rate. A B-scale would be separate rates for performing the same job in the same seat as someone hired before you. What we are suggesting is not that.

Originally Posted by RiddleEagle18

We at compass just got an e-mail regarding the basing options should the LGA deal still go through. I would imagine compass wouldnt send out this e-mail unless delta told them its still probable.

Just another indication this is far from over. I think the DOT over reached in hopes they could negotiate a few of the slots away.

Originally Posted by georgetg

That was an interesting point on the PBS Frontline Flying Cheap program.
The Contract of carriage indemnifies mainline from liability.
That legal exclusion is what really allowed the outsourcing on a massive scale to take place...

The easiest way to "fix" scope is to close that liability exclusion.
-Mainline would start doing safety audits on regionals.
-Mainline would start looking hard at training programs.
-Regionals with histories of incident would have a harder time getting or maintaining contracts.

Best of all this is a legal fix to scope that is unrelated to using negotiating capital for a new PWA...

Cheers
George

Originally Posted by UncleSam

No, you aren't nuts but you do have to consider how that would apply to codeshare & alliance partners. We all know the difference between Air France and a regional but the general public doesn't really see it that way. Granted, it would most likely apply only in other countries where our pax connect to an alliance partner. You also have to remember why they created the regionals in the first place. We used to be fed by Piedmont and U S Air, but deregulation made them our competitors. The regional have a place, but maybe better not tied so closely to a major carrier. Just a thought.