acl65pilot

Ferd;
I think everyone feels that way. We want what we had. We are upset on how it was taken. I think that describes anyone who was here or who has come here. We want our careers back. The problem is that with a want this strong, anything short of it is generally seen as a failure. In effect no one is happy unless all the demands are reached.

What I see is some saying, "Get real,"'' and many others saying "Shove off."
Most do not care if the company is profitable, or not. The just want their money. Well how do we get there?

As you said, DALPA probably has thought of it. Stuck out,ect. As I have been stating for some time. Communicate that, and many would understand the position, even if they did not agree with it.

Wherever this JV goes, we need to unify this newly minted group, or we will be divided by diverging interests in the next contract talk.

Carl Spackler

sniff...I love you Uncle Ferd...sniff

I know, I know..."get in line."

Carl

Fly4hire

Is it true that DALs F/A's only have to get a YF shot if they are scheduled to fly to a YF high risk area?

acl65pilot

It is the fear of not knowing. Even dogs feel a storm coming. I see that here. Most feel they are going to get hoodwinked. They do not like that feeling.

I hope that we are pleasantly surprised at the results. With all the parties involved, I bet the status quo of NRT will be seen as a win, and given the lopsided nature of everyone involved, that is probably going to be very true.

johnso29

The unknown is always scary, but that's life. I would think that the JAL thing is positive for us. JAL will be shrinking, and they will need international lift. They will also need feed for their domestic operation. AF/KLM and DAL can easily provide what they can not get by just themselves.

I guess this is just the way I have to look at things if I want to survive. I've got 30+ years until mandatory retirement age, and I want to make it. That doesn't mean I want to fly that long, just that I want to make it to that point.

Scoop

Disclaimer – I have flown 2 green-slips in 10 years.


Let’s see, 1.5 X pay over 80 hours or 2 X pay above the green-slip trigger (75 hours)????? Which is better????????

I think 1.5 X pay over 80 hours would not be a good thing for the following reasons:

The sky *****s would come out of the woodwork – Open time would go from being minimal (a PBS downside) to being non-existent.

The average time flown by DAL would Pilots would rise – less pilots needed – less hiring.

Let’s compare 2 guys flying a 75 hour line at $100/hour under both systems:

Both of our hypothetical Pilots, let’s call them Green-slip Guy and 80 hour man; both get an additional 5 hour opportunity.

Green-slip guy makes an additional 5 x 200 or $1000.
80 hour man makes an additional (5 x 100) or $500.

Now Green-slip Guy and 80 hour man, both get an additional 10 hour opportunity.

Green-slip guy makes 10 x 200 or $2000.
80 hour man makes (5 x 100) + (5 x150) or 500 + 750 or $1250.

Now Green-slip Guy and 80 hour man, both get an additional 15 hour opportunity.

Green-slip guy makes 15 x 200 or $3000.
80 hour man makes (5 x 100) + (10 x150) or 500 + 1500 or $2000.

I’m sure that there must be some advantages to the 80 hour system but nothing is jumping out at me – I’m sure a Pro 80 hour analysis will soon follow. It just seems to me that this would surely drive up the average time flown by a DAL pilot. Multiply a minimal increase in monthly flying 12,000 times and you get what? DAL would be fat on pilots…… again.


Scoop

acl65pilot

That is what I think.

Schwanker

Obviously, folks don't know how scheduling was done on the other side--or they'd know better.

Separate block/reserve categories played into this as well.

Schwanker

firstmob

It is about 930AM in Tokyo is no news good news?

keenster

First, budding, hardly. But who cares.

I agreed with Kingbird. He has a point. My statement about the longevity of this thread had to do with where it was going. Not so much by who was watching. It was getting downright nasty and that in effect will kill all of the good debate. We have moved beyond that. There are those that want thing thread to live, and by their desire, it will. We are in effect policing ourselves'.



Carl

As for the last part. To be successful in our desires we do not need to pigeonhole the company. Here is what the PWA states for the AF JV. This is why I am not getting my panties in a wad. It is precedent setting, and IMO what will be the outline for the JV with JAL.


4. The amount of flying subject to the AF JV flown by each partner will be determined from a summer season baseline period commencing in the summer season immediately preceding the full implementation date. All growth ASMs flown above the baseline figure by the partners will be aggregated and shared between the partners on a 50/50 basis, subject to Section 1 P. 5. [/quote]

But in this case you are dealing with the Japanese not the French. They are the No 2 or 3 economy in the world and own a passel of US debt. I doubt the Obama administration is even watching this and probably cares less what happens. In my 22 years of Flying to Japan the Japs are for the Japs and my guess is that the terms of this thing are going to be bad.