Deez340

Hey I gave you the benefit of the doubt on the degree! (Although maybe I shouldn't have as you misspelled "pedestal".) I hope you're doing all of those things. You'll be able to do it much quicker than most as you have an inside track being a current employee. After your years of hard work at becoming highly trained, highly specialized, and the burden of many lives and billions in liability rest on your shoulders, I will gladly wear a giant pin on my lapel and put a huge sticker on my flight case supporting your right to organize and negociate.......... as a Delta PILOT.

acl65pilot

Funny this is that most of these unionized members do not think that what they got was good enough.

For all of our sakes please do not turn this thread in to a Pilot v/s FA bash.

I submit that there are many flight attendants that I have flown with that are better educated than some pilots, and are working to better themselves, but that is not the majority. I know that I go out of my way to be friendly to all of you until you are not the same in return. I know it is odd to actually have a pilot engage you in conversation, but some do. Do not stereotype pilots, and I will not stereotype flight attendants. Just realize that the cost of entry to our profession takes a lot and many are quite sensitive to it.

acl65pilot

Realize that IMHO the DAL FA's have one of the best deals going. Threaten a union and you get what would take two to three years to negotiate. There is a price of entry into a union.

slowplay

1. While I understand your desire for representation, I remind you that the majority of the NWA workers were unionized. They did not have a seat at the negotiating table, and their membership received the same thing that the non-represented DALFA's did. If representation was the key to success, why did IAM and AFA fail?

Your union can only has the leverage provided by the law, its membership, and the financial status of the company.

2. A union without unity is worse than no union at all. Look what happened to ALPA at Delta in 1996.

3. A union with poor leadership is far worse than no union at all. Look what happened to AMFA at NWA. Look at the "success" of APA.

3. A union with great leadership can make things happen, both for the membership and their company, as long as the company has a sound economic plan.

4. A union burdened with a crappy management or economic situation is only effective at mitigating problems and finding more employee friendly solutions. Look at the UAW, a very powerful union, in their situation with GM, Delphi, and the rest of the auto industry.

jmo, and I'm probably wrong.

Hawaii50

If it does happen it will be part of an AE so you'll have time to update your displacement preferences.

DALFA

Because pilots were the only ones represented on both sides. DL knows that the chance of any other employee group at DL voting in a union is slim to none, besides that F/A group...we have gotten things back in the past year or so leading up to right before our first union vote. The problem is that IF this vote fails, the company can stick their hands right back in our pockets and take it all away...and you have an argument that we can organize again once all this happens. Start from scratch again? This campaign has been in the works for 5 years...who knows what DL can take in the next 5!

Jughead

Just so I know, what unionized flight attendant groups (U.S.) are more highly compensated and have better work rules than Delta's? I'm not disparaging your efforts - just curious. Again, not a pilot v. F/A thing, but I'm hoping for a long list so I can see what has been taken away due to the non-union environment.

slowplay

I disagree. They failed because they had no strategic vision. They failed because they had no plan. They failed because they looked rearward, not forward.

Don't forget that NWA ALPA stood in opposition to the merger until late June. The MEC's had been negotiating since January. When management said they were going to merge with or without the pilots, the Delta MEC in April got the best deal possible at the time, and then made sure the NWA pilots got the same deal in June. That whole time the NWA MEC was YouTubing it up while communicating inaccurately to its membership. All the whining and bellyaching the NWA MEC did during the March-June timeframe sure looked funny in light of Stevens and O'Malleys SLI testimony.

The IAM and AFA stood in staunch opposition to the DAL-NWA merger. They went to Capitol Hill. They picketed. They called NWA and Delta pilots "scabs" while leafletting. End result, just a lot of noise. The merger was overwhelmingly approved. The IAM and AFA got nothing more than you did for their membership. That's ineffective.

How'd AMFA do for the NWA mechanics? How many unions have the NWA flight attendants tried?

You have your right to representation should your group so choose. My previous points stand in light of the facts.

DALFA

Actually its good for you to ask...it shows that you care!

http://www.apfa.org/images/contract/...comparison.pdf

This is from 2006, I know its 2 years ago...but its the closest thing I found. We have had a couple of improvements just like everyone else has...so the info could be just a little off!

iaflyer

Thanks for posting that - I'm new at Delta and was wondering what the FAs made. It felt crass to ask the FAs, but pilots I flew with didn't really know. Thanks!