Any "Latest & Greatest" about Delta?
12-03-2009, 06:35 AM
veut gagner à la loterie
Joined APC: Apr 2008
Position: Light Chop
Posts: 23,286
Yes.
But then we ended up going to war with them. Then we went to war with England again and by the end of the next century we had gone to war with Canada, Mexico, Tripoli, ourselves, Spain, Indians, pirates, the Phillipians and so on. We were born fightinV weren't we?
bit to your larger point, I think Sarkosy was a turn to the right by France.
But then we ended up going to war with them. Then we went to war with England again and by the end of the next century we had gone to war with Canada, Mexico, Tripoli, ourselves, Spain, Indians, pirates, the Phillipians and so on. We were born fightinV weren't we?
bit to your larger point, I think Sarkosy was a turn to the right by France.
12-03-2009, 06:43 AM
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Apr 2008
Posts: 1,462
Here's my take:
Last winter, we had SILs for categories that were overstaffed. Some, like ATL ER had a bunch - and last winter we were flying more than this winter. Even this September there were some SILs if I recall. October, no SILs - many thought it was odd because we had been hearing how overstaffed we were and maybe furloughs. November, no SILs. Odder.
Then, in early October, poof, out of thin air comes the NFL option, and we've had no SILs since then. I agree that the company may be seeing it as "15 hours of pay to get another guy on reserve is fine." Fine by me too, because as a reserve, I'm barely flying. I flew 1 trip in October, and two in November. The company discontinued SILs *while* NFLs were being negotiated. I would bet a dollar that the company bluffed and told the union, "oh, by the way, we don't plan on SILs anytime soon, so you get NFLs or nothing" hoping the union would agree. If I had been a rep, I'd say, "no, lets stick with SILs - I bet they will cave and we'll get SILs all winter long".
True, the NFL does give pilots the option of a 1 or more months leave of absence essentially. Perfect for the guy with another business, military reservists who want the month off and can add flying/pay there, the pilot who wants the holidays off and has money saved, long vacation, etc etc.
But, SILs did the same thing, you just got paid 55 hours. I think SILs are better for the pilot group as a whole than NFLs. If the MEC has asked our opinion about NFLs, I think that the pilot group would of said that. Also, SILs make a category smaller for that month, allowing more junior guys to have lines.
NFLs do the same thing, but there are far less NFLs being taken than SILs. I think someone else did the calculations and SILs are cheaper for the company than NFLs, because few people are taking NFLs than SILs.
Last winter, we had SILs for categories that were overstaffed. Some, like ATL ER had a bunch - and last winter we were flying more than this winter. Even this September there were some SILs if I recall. October, no SILs - many thought it was odd because we had been hearing how overstaffed we were and maybe furloughs. November, no SILs. Odder.
Then, in early October, poof, out of thin air comes the NFL option, and we've had no SILs since then. I agree that the company may be seeing it as "15 hours of pay to get another guy on reserve is fine." Fine by me too, because as a reserve, I'm barely flying. I flew 1 trip in October, and two in November. The company discontinued SILs *while* NFLs were being negotiated. I would bet a dollar that the company bluffed and told the union, "oh, by the way, we don't plan on SILs anytime soon, so you get NFLs or nothing" hoping the union would agree. If I had been a rep, I'd say, "no, lets stick with SILs - I bet they will cave and we'll get SILs all winter long".
True, the NFL does give pilots the option of a 1 or more months leave of absence essentially. Perfect for the guy with another business, military reservists who want the month off and can add flying/pay there, the pilot who wants the holidays off and has money saved, long vacation, etc etc.
But, SILs did the same thing, you just got paid 55 hours. I think SILs are better for the pilot group as a whole than NFLs. If the MEC has asked our opinion about NFLs, I think that the pilot group would of said that. Also, SILs make a category smaller for that month, allowing more junior guys to have lines.
NFLs do the same thing, but there are far less NFLs being taken than SILs. I think someone else did the calculations and SILs are cheaper for the company than NFLs, because few people are taking NFLs than SILs.
There's at least one serious error in your logic. NFLs haven't replaced SILs. Perhaps that was the company's hope, but it didn't work out that way. As Alfa and you both stated, there were tons of SILs last year, and "should" have been tons this year. But now we have NFLs which hardly anyone takes. So if the company's goal was/is to save money, and NFLs are so under utilized, why wouldn't they come out and offer at least a fair number of SILs?
12-03-2009, 08:02 AM
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Feb 2008
Posts: 19,596
iahflyer,
There's at least one serious error in your logic. NFLs haven't replaced SILs. Perhaps that was the company's hope, but it didn't work out that way. As Alfa and you both stated, there were tons of SILs last year, and "should" have been tons this year. But now we have NFLs which hardly anyone takes. So if the company's goal was/is to save money, and NFLs are so under utilized, why wouldn't they come out and offer at least a fair number of SILs?
There's at least one serious error in your logic. NFLs haven't replaced SILs. Perhaps that was the company's hope, but it didn't work out that way. As Alfa and you both stated, there were tons of SILs last year, and "should" have been tons this year. But now we have NFLs which hardly anyone takes. So if the company's goal was/is to save money, and NFLs are so under utilized, why wouldn't they come out and offer at least a fair number of SILs?
Because they are not required to offer SIL's and when they audited the whole program it was costing them money. The 15 hours saved did not offset the increase in Green Slips unless a category was really overmanned. It appears the categories are not as overmanned this winter as last. ER Captains in NY are running about the required numbers most days. In Atlanta they are above required by not by a whole lot. Last winter they often had 4o more Captains then required. They also has some occasions last winter where they had to cancel flights when bad weather hit and reserves were out of position. More reserves might have saved those flights. It takes a huge number of SIL to offset the cost of one cancelled international flight.
12-03-2009, 08:21 AM
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Apr 2008
Posts: 1,462
Because they are not required to offer SIL's and when they audited the whole program it was costing them money. The 15 hours saved did not offset the increase in Green Slips unless a category was really overmanned. It appears the categories are not as overmanned this winter as last. ER Captains in NY are running about the required numbers most days. In Atlanta they are above required by not by a whole lot. Last winter they often had 4o more Captains then required. They also has some occasions last winter where they had to cancel flights when bad weather hit and reserves were out of position. More reserves might have saved those flights. It takes a huge number of SIL to offset the cost of one cancelled international flight.
iahflyer and others are blaming ALPA for negotiating NFLs and claiming that is the reason SILs are no longer being offered and I don't believe that. It is yet another reason for the bash ALPA crowd to bash ALPA, which is always a fun side job.
12-03-2009, 08:33 AM
seeing the large hubs...
Joined APC: Oct 2006
Position: 73N A
Posts: 3,747
sailingfun, I agree with you. I was trying to show the error in iahflyer's logic that said NFLs were a replacement for SILs which I, like you, agree they aren't. SILs seemed like a good idea at the time to DAL and were a GREAT deal for the pilots, but weren't contractually required, and in the end DAL determined they weren't worth it to pay a guy 55 hours and have zero ability to use him.
iahflyer and others are blaming ALPA for negotiating NFLs and claiming that is the reason SILs are no longer being offered and I don't believe that. It is yet another reason for the bash ALPA crowd to bash ALPA, which is always a fun side job.
iahflyer and others are blaming ALPA for negotiating NFLs and claiming that is the reason SILs are no longer being offered and I don't believe that. It is yet another reason for the bash ALPA crowd to bash ALPA, which is always a fun side job.
As for SILs costing the company money, like I said, that might be possible. However, most of the GS I've seen on the ER-B the last few months are for trips that show in a very tight time frame - within 1-3 hours. In these cases, the SCs must of been used, and there isn't time for a LC pilot. In the past six months, I can't remember a GS going out for a trip further than 3 hours. There is a lot of whiteslips for next day trips, but no GS.
I'm not an ALPA basher, I really think they do some good stuff. But they tend to not be pushing the envelope on issues these days. It doesn't take a lot of negotiationing to agree to what the company wants - isn't that why we have a union?
12-03-2009, 08:36 AM
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Sep 2008
Position: Kickin’ Back
Posts: 6,971
A little off topic but what's with the logon screen when I try to access the DALPA forum from the home page after I have already logged on?
I log on to the DALPA website and then select forums and I get another logon screen which does not use my same log on username and password. Any ideas? Thanks,
Denny
I log on to the DALPA website and then select forums and I get another logon screen which does not use my same log on username and password. Any ideas? Thanks,
Denny
12-03-2009, 09:02 AM
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Feb 2008
Posts: 354
Thank god the 88 gets a break in January at 72 hrs. Question: If my base month is feb for recurrent, when and how do you bid golden days for training? Do you get to select the days you train? I haven't had to do this yet because when I was up for training on the ER, I went to 88 school. Thanks!!
12-03-2009, 09:14 AM
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Apr 2008
Posts: 1,462
Thank god the 88 gets a break in January at 72 hrs. Question: If my base month is feb for recurrent, when and how do you bid golden days for training? Do you get to select the days you train? I haven't had to do this yet because when I was up for training on the ER, I went to 88 school. Thanks!!
What stinks about this is that by the time you get the pop up window that you're in the zone for training, its already too late to protect your first month. In your case, if Feb is your base month, you could go to training Jan - Mar, but you have to put in a golden day request for Jan by NLT Nov 30. UGH.
12-03-2009, 09:17 AM
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Sep 2008
Position: Kickin’ Back
Posts: 6,971
Golden days for training are up to 5 days in a row that you can specify that you DO NOT want to go to training in a particular month. To input days go to the Training/VTS tab and then select option B.
Be aware that, if your window starts in Feb, you need to at least designate Feb golden days by Dec. 31, Mar by Jan 30, and so on. You can also do them all at the same time.
Designating these days does not mean you will not or cannot fly on them, all it means is you will not be trained on them.
Denny
Be aware that, if your window starts in Feb, you need to at least designate Feb golden days by Dec. 31, Mar by Jan 30, and so on. You can also do them all at the same time.
Designating these days does not mean you will not or cannot fly on them, all it means is you will not be trained on them.
Denny
12-03-2009, 09:20 AM
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Sep 2008
Position: Kickin’ Back
Posts: 6,971
You don't get to select days you want to train but can protect one group of days (from 1 to 5 days) that you DON'T want to train. To do that, log onto eCrew, then select, "Personnel" from the top then "Training/VTS" on the drop down menu. Then the second bullet is what you're looking for.
What stinks about this is that by the time you get the pop up window that you're in the zone for training, its already too late to protect your first month. In your case, if Feb is your base month, you could go to training Jan - Mar, but you have to put in a golden day request for Jan by NLT Nov 30. UGH.
What stinks about this is that by the time you get the pop up window that you're in the zone for training, its already too late to protect your first month. In your case, if Feb is your base month, you could go to training Jan - Mar, but you have to put in a golden day request for Jan by NLT Nov 30. UGH.
Pineapple you got to it before me!
My WWO training is Jan-Mar and this exact thing just happened!! Un fortunately for me I really would have liked to designate day for Jan.Denny
Thread
Thread Starter
Forum
Replies
Last Post
