Free Bird

So many different directions to go with the above statement. It would be nice to see some Scope on the lower end recaptured in exchange for help on the JAL JV deal. Mainline pilots fly all additional 76 seaters that come as a result of the 3 for 1 language.

Let's hope DALPA doesn't give this away.

I can dream right?

acl65pilot

Oh buddy, I agree more than you know. My point of posting that, is that after going back and forth on here and other venues, I get the distinct impression that it is the goal of DALPA to allow DAL to create before we demand as we do not want to destroy the master plan by putting our foot down and actually demanding a few gains here and there.

I get the impression that by allowing DAL to get the AF, and JAL JV's it will allow DAL the world dominance that many feel is needed to demand the restoration that all pilots want. Without the revenue stream and the ability to effectively carry any passenger anywhere in the world, we could not demand and expect what the pilots want.

I see some issues with not getting a few gains and tieing them to DAL and not the the other partners in the deal, but OTOH I can get a game plan like this. It makes sense if we keep the same management team and have a true understanding with them. The house of cards falls apart when the management team we are dealing with goes to greener pasturer or retires. The we start all over again with new ideas and a new mission by a new board makeup or a new CEO.

That is part of the reason why I think we need to be for the deal, but very cautious and demand something from DAL for agreeing to the deal but not necessarily something that could kill the deal. Make sense?

acl65pilot

http://web.mit.edu/airlinedata/www/2...Equivalent.htm

Free Bird

It does make sense. That being said this pilot group as been VERY cooperative going back to the BK. Mngt. has had very little resistance to anything they have tried to accomplish. I really hope that mngt. and DALPA are mindful of this.

I certainly don't think it's unreasonable for this pilot group to be rewarded for our helping hand. As much as some on here brag about our "pay raises", I think after January 1 we'll still be paid less than our AMR counterparts.

For DALPA to make this JV another easy go for Delta managment, it is reasonable to have certain protections in place for the pilots.

Back to my German beer, NFL and NASCAR.

acl65pilot

Go look at the above link. It will make your blood pressure rise.

It is from MIT, FWIW.

FlyingViking

Maybe, just maybe it is time to regroup and form our own union? Maybe?

Sink r8

ACL,

To the extent that this "world dominance" has contractual ramifications that require our approval, then such "dominance" will be purchased from all parties, whether JAL, or DALPA. Obviously, it's not simply a question of mutual benefit. After all, we are arguing that JAL will reap huge financial rewards in a JV AND we are willing to pay them for it.

You want it, you pay for it.

So I think we agree fully.

ratsnrip

The per pilot employee expenses for a Hawaiian Airlines pilot in 1999 was ...
$2,456,399 ? Something doesn't seem right!

Bucking Bar

Attend and LEC meeting and ask about the money we set aside for our own budget. It is my impression we have (and are) building a war chest to ensure the strength and stability to pursue our goals, adding to the strength of ALPA's MCF.

Bucking Bar

C2K was really something.

Would our crew augmentation and relief pilot numbers throw that chart off?