Any "Latest & Greatest" about Delta?
06-02-2014, 07:02 AM
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Jan 2011
Posts: 403
It is a B-Scale.
06-02-2014, 07:05 AM
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Oct 2012
Posts: 133
DAL interviews these pilots, vets them and them holds them out for five years.
UAL and AMR know they are vetted by DAL, and starts picking them off in year two and three.
Brilliant.
Best way to do this whole thing is with DCI as part of mainline. Seniority, longevity day one, where you can attract the best and retain them because there will be a clear career path. AMR and UAL will not be able to poach a pilot that has a DAL number. If DAL really wants to solve this staffing issue that is leading to cancelations, and hurting their bottom line, they need to work a solution with DALPA that returns this flying to mainline and allow DALPA to bargain for it.
On the surface it may appear more expensive to DAL, but few summers of network issues due to lack of crew will more than make up the increased labor costs.
This ideas sounds good, but in reality others will poach them, and I would too. Also five years is a joke. "reliability requirement?" I assume that is sick leave usage.
We do not need to get in to a military v civilian debate. There are plenty of military pilots at the regionals too. Pilots that want to come to the mainline but wanted airline experience. We need an industry solution, not a civilian or military solution. This is about fixing DAL network and staffing issues, and the pilots having a career path that does not reset at some point in the middle of it. This program does not do that.
06-02-2014, 07:11 AM
Can't abide NAI
Joined APC: Jun 2007
Position: Douglas Aerospace post production Flight Test & Work Around Engineering bulletin dissembler
Posts: 12,037
It is worse because of:
Loss of longevity
Promise of employment ... a promise which management has a terrible track record of keeping
No job security ... company can furlough Delta pilots while hiring at Endeavor
Union has compete with itself against other pilots in the Delta system
Junior FO'S have better seniority rights than senior Captains
Pilots are trading empty promises for money and holding company's costs down with a corporate shell game
QOL issues. Pilots can not bid equipment or bases within the divided system
Extra expense - separate certificates require redundant management structures and each Certificate is in fact another fleet type under the regulations with different mechanics and crews.
In efficient - airplanes are constrained to arbitrary scope limits rather than their Certified capabilities.
That's just off the top if my head on my phone in the tag office.
Loss of longevity
Promise of employment ... a promise which management has a terrible track record of keeping
No job security ... company can furlough Delta pilots while hiring at Endeavor
Union has compete with itself against other pilots in the Delta system
Junior FO'S have better seniority rights than senior Captains
Pilots are trading empty promises for money and holding company's costs down with a corporate shell game
QOL issues. Pilots can not bid equipment or bases within the divided system
Extra expense - separate certificates require redundant management structures and each Certificate is in fact another fleet type under the regulations with different mechanics and crews.
In efficient - airplanes are constrained to arbitrary scope limits rather than their Certified capabilities.
That's just off the top if my head on my phone in the tag office.
06-02-2014, 07:12 AM
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Aug 2007
Position: undefined
Posts: 328
I am starting to think airshows are not for me, as we lost another one this weekend.
RIP, Bill Cowden, MSP 7ER. While I didn't know him, I know a few of his friends, and they are devastated.
UPDATE: Police identify pilot killed in plane crash - WAOW - Newsline 9, Wausau News, Weather, Sports
RIP, Bill Cowden, MSP 7ER. While I didn't know him, I know a few of his friends, and they are devastated.
UPDATE: Police identify pilot killed in plane crash - WAOW - Newsline 9, Wausau News, Weather, Sports
06-02-2014, 07:25 AM
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Dec 2010
Position: MD FO
Posts: 107
The EtD is advertised as being a Delta staffing solution but it seems to be an Endeavor staffing solution to me. I doubt Delta cares if they leave for another major as long as they come to Endeavor as their stepping stone.
06-02-2014, 07:44 AM
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Oct 2005
Position: Left, left, left right left....
Posts: 911
They don't, but an this is a unilateral attempt by management to solve locally an much broader industry problem. In order to solve it all stake holders need to be involved, specifically ALPA.
The program is full of holes and landmines, many that might have been avoided by consulting and partnering with DALPA. Instead they went it alone and are counting on a tepid protest, or even tacit approval from the MEC.
I'd love to see the Donatelli of some videos of years past, and throw this ill-conceived program back with an ALPA stamp of disapproval.
The program is full of holes and landmines, many that might have been avoided by consulting and partnering with DALPA. Instead they went it alone and are counting on a tepid protest, or even tacit approval from the MEC.
I'd love to see the Donatelli of some videos of years past, and throw this ill-conceived program back with an ALPA stamp of disapproval.
06-02-2014, 07:48 AM
No longer cares
Joined APC: Mar 2008
Position: 767er Captain
Posts: 12,109
They don't, but at other properties in the past, flow throughs have been at least partially been negotiated by ALPA as part of section 1 Scope protections, specifically flow backs.
I guess the Co. didn't see the need to exercise the highly vaunted engagement on this. Or maybe it's just a one way-street
I guess the Co. didn't see the need to exercise the highly vaunted engagement on this. Or maybe it's just a one way-street
They don't, but an this is a unilateral attempt by management to solve locally an much broader industry problem. In order to solve it all stake holders need to be involved, specifically ALPA.
The program is full of holes and landmines, many that might have been avoided by consulting and partnering with DALPA. Instead they went it alone and are counting on a tepid protest, or even tacit approval from the MEC.
I'd love to see the Donatelli of some videos of years past, and throw this ill-conceived program back with an ALPA stamp of disapproval.
The program is full of holes and landmines, many that might have been avoided by consulting and partnering with DALPA. Instead they went it alone and are counting on a tepid protest, or even tacit approval from the MEC.
I'd love to see the Donatelli of some videos of years past, and throw this ill-conceived program back with an ALPA stamp of disapproval.
Again, why? It might be nice to have ALPA involved, but it certainly is not incumbent upon us to solve this problem. As a matter of fact, our helping might lessen any leverage we might have down the road. If managements get into panic mode, they will come to us, and that creates leverage.
06-02-2014, 07:48 AM
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Apr 2009
Posts: 1,576
Big unlike
I am starting to think airshows are not for me, as we lost another one this weekend.
RIP, Bill Cowden, MSP 7ER. While I didn't know him, I know a few of his friends, and they are devastated.
UPDATE: Police identify pilot killed in plane crash - WAOW - Newsline 9, Wausau News, Weather, Sports
RIP, Bill Cowden, MSP 7ER. While I didn't know him, I know a few of his friends, and they are devastated.
UPDATE: Police identify pilot killed in plane crash - WAOW - Newsline 9, Wausau News, Weather, Sports
06-02-2014, 07:59 AM
No longer cares
Joined APC: Mar 2008
Position: 767er Captain
Posts: 12,109
Do you seriously think this is an issue? I guess we can bring it up in C15 if it really bothers you, but I think it is much ado about little. They still have to decipher a way to attract pilots to a minimum wage job, and I don't believe they are gonna be knocking any doors off of any hinges to get that.
06-02-2014, 08:03 AM
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Jul 2009
Position: Lowest Pay I Could Find
Posts: 1,044
Later this morning Endeavor and Delta will jointly announce the Endeavor to Delta Pilot Hiring
and Commitment Program (EtD Commitment) that was structured jointly by both airlines. The
EtD Commitment is designed to attract the most competitive pilots to Endeavor by identifying a
clear career path to Delta with a level of commitment for a job at a major carrier that no other
regional carrier is offering. With competition for qualified pilots among regional carriers as tight
as ever, the EtD Commitment is expected to bolster Endeavor’s ability to attract career-minded
pilots while positioning Endeavor for growth –and that’s good for all Endeavor people.
Complete details of the EtD Commitment can be found at Endeavor Air but here are
some of the highlights, as well as important enhancements to the SSP program:
o Starting June 15, the EtD Commitment will use Delta’s rigorous two-day interview protocol to
select all new-hire Endeavor pilots based on the same high standards used by Delta,
allowing for differences in experience. Delta representatives also will be involved in this
selection process. Applicant screening under the new EtD Commitment will begin
immediately.
o Starting June 15, all pilots who receive a conditional job offer at Endeavor will be offered a
commitment to be hired by Delta once all eligibility requirements are satisfied. These pilots
will not be required to re-interview with Delta or otherwise participate in the normal Delta
pilot selection process.
o Current Endeavor pilots eligible for Delta’s Streamlined Selection Process (SSP) will be
offered an opportunity to interview with Delta before any pilot in the EtD Commitment
program is “called up.” Should a current Endeavor pilot be unsuccessful in applying with
Delta, s/he will continue flying with Endeavor, whereas new-hire applicants who are not
selected under Delta’s protocol via the EtD Commitment will not be offered employment at
Endeavor.
o Delta and Endeavor have agreed to provide current Endeavor pilots hired after the Bridge
Agreement and prior to the EtD Commitment implementation with the same seniority-order
SSP interview opportunity as other Endeavor pilots. These pilots will now have a similar
opportunity to compete for a Delta job as SSP pilots.
o Delta and Endeavor also have agreed to bolster career stability and progression for current
Endeavor pilots by increasing the rate of hiring under the SSP to 35 percent of all available
new hire pilot positions in a calendar year, or 300 pilots in a calendar year, whichever is
less. So in a year when Delta hires 600 new-hire pilots (excluding Compass flow ups), 210,
or 35 percent, will come from SSP-eligible Endeavor pilots. As a result, going forward the
SSP and EtD Commitment will fill approximately one third of Delta’s pilot hiring needs,
allowing for continuous and enhanced career progression for current and new Endeavor
pilots.
and Commitment Program (EtD Commitment) that was structured jointly by both airlines. The
EtD Commitment is designed to attract the most competitive pilots to Endeavor by identifying a
clear career path to Delta with a level of commitment for a job at a major carrier that no other
regional carrier is offering. With competition for qualified pilots among regional carriers as tight
as ever, the EtD Commitment is expected to bolster Endeavor’s ability to attract career-minded
pilots while positioning Endeavor for growth –and that’s good for all Endeavor people.
Complete details of the EtD Commitment can be found at Endeavor Air but here are
some of the highlights, as well as important enhancements to the SSP program:
o Starting June 15, the EtD Commitment will use Delta’s rigorous two-day interview protocol to
select all new-hire Endeavor pilots based on the same high standards used by Delta,
allowing for differences in experience. Delta representatives also will be involved in this
selection process. Applicant screening under the new EtD Commitment will begin
immediately.
o Starting June 15, all pilots who receive a conditional job offer at Endeavor will be offered a
commitment to be hired by Delta once all eligibility requirements are satisfied. These pilots
will not be required to re-interview with Delta or otherwise participate in the normal Delta
pilot selection process.
o Current Endeavor pilots eligible for Delta’s Streamlined Selection Process (SSP) will be
offered an opportunity to interview with Delta before any pilot in the EtD Commitment
program is “called up.” Should a current Endeavor pilot be unsuccessful in applying with
Delta, s/he will continue flying with Endeavor, whereas new-hire applicants who are not
selected under Delta’s protocol via the EtD Commitment will not be offered employment at
Endeavor.
o Delta and Endeavor have agreed to provide current Endeavor pilots hired after the Bridge
Agreement and prior to the EtD Commitment implementation with the same seniority-order
SSP interview opportunity as other Endeavor pilots. These pilots will now have a similar
opportunity to compete for a Delta job as SSP pilots.
o Delta and Endeavor also have agreed to bolster career stability and progression for current
Endeavor pilots by increasing the rate of hiring under the SSP to 35 percent of all available
new hire pilot positions in a calendar year, or 300 pilots in a calendar year, whichever is
less. So in a year when Delta hires 600 new-hire pilots (excluding Compass flow ups), 210,
or 35 percent, will come from SSP-eligible Endeavor pilots. As a result, going forward the
SSP and EtD Commitment will fill approximately one third of Delta’s pilot hiring needs,
allowing for continuous and enhanced career progression for current and new Endeavor
pilots.
I'm still not sure this will work to get people to come to work for 5 years of slave wages in return for a promise. I guess we will see. Overall, this is bad for all parties involved.
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