Any "Latest & Greatest" about Delta?
10-10-2009, 04:27 AM
Happy to be here
Joined APC: Jun 2006
Position: A-320A
Posts: 18,563
You have some very good, very experienced pilots at CPS. The pilot you speak of is a minority voice. Keep him that way. Your current CPS coordinator would make a fine MEC Chair.
I am discouraged by this action of the S side of the MEC. I guess there were too many preconceived notions over DCI for them to get past. If you look at the FNWA and FDAL MEC's they could not have been at further ends of the spectrum on their dealings with their feeder affiliates.
Get your good guys out there and form a MEC and alliance with the DAL pilots that breaks the traditional DAL model. You have lots of support despite this setback.
I am discouraged by this action of the S side of the MEC. I guess there were too many preconceived notions over DCI for them to get past. If you look at the FNWA and FDAL MEC's they could not have been at further ends of the spectrum on their dealings with their feeder affiliates.
Get your good guys out there and form a MEC and alliance with the DAL pilots that breaks the traditional DAL model. You have lots of support despite this setback.
10-10-2009, 04:32 AM
Happy to be here
Joined APC: Jun 2006
Position: A-320A
Posts: 18,563
Frankly, my comment, DPA+1, was not aimed at our current LEC's or MEC. It was based on the statements by a recent jumpseater who recently quit doing ALPA work. According to him, DALPA contributes over 12 Million per year to the coffers of ALPA Nat'l. Our R.O.I. however, is only a little over 3 Million per year. We are, according to him, subsidizing everyone else in ALPA. Is this true, or am I p/o'ed for no good reason? If it is true, we certainly could use that money to start and maintain our own "in house" union, hence the DPA+1 comment.
10-10-2009, 04:37 AM
Happy to be here
Joined APC: Jun 2006
Position: A-320A
Posts: 18,563
Point is that CPS representing themselves in HOPES that they will be able to navigate around all of the landmines both at CPS and at DAL to get in effect a vote done, that states they want to be 1) represented by DALPA, and 2) integrate.
In the end, it is what it is, this is a major set back, but not one that we cannot overcome. It just sucks that we keep shooting ourselves in the foot.
ALFA has a point there is a risk of a lawsuit here, but it ain't happened yet. Fear is a very bad thing, we have been fighting a losing scope battle for year, now it just looks like we do not even want to help ourselves.
In the end, it is what it is, this is a major set back, but not one that we cannot overcome. It just sucks that we keep shooting ourselves in the foot.
ALFA has a point there is a risk of a lawsuit here, but it ain't happened yet. Fear is a very bad thing, we have been fighting a losing scope battle for year, now it just looks like we do not even want to help ourselves.
10-10-2009, 04:45 AM
Happy to be here
Joined APC: Jun 2006
Position: A-320A
Posts: 18,563
I just wonder why we always look at a situation and look at the issues and not the advantages. Yes, there are issues with DALPA representing both groups, but there are advantages too!
10-10-2009, 05:19 AM
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Apr 2007
Position: Flying the SEC
Posts: 2,350
Change of subject, but what's up with delta net and icrew? I keep getting kicked out. I get inactivity messages some times before I finish reading my schedule! It's gotta be those darn NW guys! (seriously TIC!)
10-10-2009, 05:27 AM
Can't abide NAI
Joined APC: Jun 2007
Position: Douglas Aerospace post production Flight Test & Work Around Engineering bulletin dissembler
Posts: 12,037
However, I do not expect things to go that direction due to the number of pilots involved, their relative inexperience and the fact that like the Frog in the proverbial pot, the heat is getting turned up rather slowly. Most people are really fuzzy on where things go from here.
If history is our guide, Delta pilots will suffer the greatest harm from our own misguided scope policy. When ASA and Comair were excluded, they grew explosively while Delta pilots hit the streets. Eventually ASA and Comair pilots’ own scope failures caught up with them and what management awardeth, management taketh away, and giveth to lower cost providers. Without effective union representation management's ability to whipsaw and destroy longevity knows no restraint.
Compass is currently bound by a special scope exemption which keeps them at a relatively uneconomic size of 36 jets. I expect that will change. We currently have a flow through which neither management or current ALPA is particularly fond of. I expect that will change. Management would like to raise cash and it was going to be difficult to spin Compass off with "Delta" pilots flying the jets. We've simply facilitated this transaction. My crystal ball says management is in Compass's yard with a "FOR SALE" sign and we're hammering into the soil for them.
It should be a campaign issue for Reps who voted for yet another sale of Delta jobs. Sure, the Reps will prevaricate and say this wasn't really a sale. After all, they've already indicated on the Delta south side that it was not worth anything to begin with and we still get to live in it (via flow down) when our seniority list sinks beneath the flood waters of economic storms and fleet rationalization.
Just remember to draw a line through the factual data points, even if those data points are years apart. Look back through history and see how it has worked out before.
Last edited by Bucking Bar; 10-10-2009 at 06:51 AM.
10-10-2009, 05:35 AM
Moderator
Joined APC: Oct 2006
Position: B757/767
Posts: 13,088
What happens when management wants E-190s at Compass? How does an MEC represent this issue without a DFR lawsuit? What about when Compass wants more pay raises than mainline? How do you represent two groups when their interests diverge? Frankly I cannot believe that the NWA MEC set up this loony arrangement in the first place. Compass needs to represent themselves and same with Delta.
ALPA has failed in protecting & enhancing the careers they were created to protect by bringing in pilot groups who are jobs are outsourced to. So much for taking it back. More like taking all the dues we can to fatten ALPA Nationals wallets.
Frankly I can't believe ALPA National created & continues to promote that loony cr@p everyday.
10-10-2009, 05:48 AM
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Jun 2007
Position: Legacy FO
Posts: 4,105
Stupid question? Could there be a class action lawsuit against Alpa National for their continuing support of regional pilot groups which directly compete with our jobs, pay and benefits, and quality of life -- and as history has shown, have had increases in jobs, pay and benefits, and quality of life, while the mainline pilots lossed in all of these areas?
It sounds to me that Alpa failed to take care of #1. And #1 is angry.
It sounds to me that Alpa failed to take care of #1. And #1 is angry.
10-10-2009, 05:49 AM
Moderator
Joined APC: Oct 2006
Position: B757/767
Posts: 13,088
We have pay scales for those jets now. If we allow DCI to fly em, we might as well furlough the bottom 25% of the list before it is allowed. It would make the fight a lot smaller when it came to a vote.
In reality I see the 10 seat jet coming to mainline. It would cause way too much bad blood not to.
As I understand it the issue with CPS being represented by DAL's MEC is that it makes our chair serve two master with diverging interests. There are better solutions to this problem.
In reality I see the 10 seat jet coming to mainline. It would cause way too much bad blood not to.
As I understand it the issue with CPS being represented by DAL's MEC is that it makes our chair serve two master with diverging interests. There are better solutions to this problem.
I agree. I think RA is too smart to outsource the 100 seater. He knows the massive waves it would cause, & if he wants to improve the DAL product then outsourcing 100 seaters to DCI would be a HUGE mistake.
10-10-2009, 05:50 AM
Can't abide NAI
Joined APC: Jun 2007
Position: Douglas Aerospace post production Flight Test & Work Around Engineering bulletin dissembler
Posts: 12,037
deleted ....
Last edited by Bucking Bar; 10-10-2009 at 06:48 AM.
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