Any "Latest & Greatest" about Delta?
11-18-2013, 07:47 PM
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11-18-2013, 07:49 PM
Back on TDY
Joined APC: Apr 2008
Position: 747-400 Captain
Posts: 12,487
Nah, you can do both. Is the question too hard for you?
Here it is again:
Carl
Here it is again:
Simple question Bar. What if I as a DPA supporter wanted to help my cause along by hacking into ALPA national's website, redirect it to a fake site that denigrated ALPA, then disconnected the funding link to the ALPA PAC. Would you argue to ALPA that they shouldn't investigate it because old Carl might get in legal trouble?
Carl
11-18-2013, 07:58 PM
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Yes Carl it is much better to start off posts by calling people names. It's good though it lets you deflect form answering questions especially the ones that don't make you or DPA look so good.
By the way if it matters this is one fence sitter you have pushed back over to the ALPA side.
By the way if it matters this is one fence sitter you have pushed back over to the ALPA side.
Carl
11-18-2013, 08:06 PM
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I'm also not impressed that the DPA is pursuing a Delta pilot. Maybe professional standards is a committee that will cease to exist under DPA. Going after one of our own, regardless of the sin, is unacceptable. The ultimatum of going public or else is unnecessary theatrics. Won't surprise me at all if this "hacker" was hatched in the same part of Tampa that brought us the abortion letter. 
GMAFB.
GMAFB.If for argument sake you are assuming the DPA account of events to be true, why ignore the part where Tim asked the individual to identify himself and apologize?
Scoop
11-18-2013, 08:15 PM
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All that said, given what I've seen of the crew van news updates recently, I'm skeptical that everything in today's update is squeaky clean. In fact, I'm suspicious that some of it is downright fabricated.
Time will tell, but I sense this is shaping up to be another DPA folly.
11-18-2013, 08:15 PM
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IMHO management has what they need and seeks to cancel "constructive engagement." I also hope ALPA is finished with scope sales. These forces appear to be coming together with the likely result that Contract 2015 will be a traditional, perhaps combative, labor negotiation.
My concern is how durable this little upturn we are currently "enjoying" will last. We are well positioned for openers. Management may see a benefit to dragging things out until the logical end of this business cycle.
First off you all missed a good MNF game while getting all worked up over hacking. Silly. You have all day tomorrow when there is no football on to do that!
More important, Bars post. Wouldn't be surprised if he is right. Constructive engagement has never been a sound tactic. When our interests align with managements, then there is no reason not to work together. USAirways bid, Im/Ex bank, ME customs pre-clearance facility, etc.
When our interest do not align, we should be vocal and be firm. Good example is when now Sleepy Ed announced to Wall Street that pilot pay and benefits have been permanently reset. When he did that, it was good business for management and Delta.
DALPA would be fully in their right to release a statement detailing the amount the pilots have given from BK to present without obtaining a return on our investment... yet. Then, finish the statement emphasizing that we will have to have a complete return on our investment in 2015. That's it. And, for pilots, that is good business. And, it's not personal or attacking management, it isn't being obstructionist either. It is just business.
BB also stated a concern over the state of the economy going forward. It can be argued that the economy still really hasn't fully recovered at all. Ben is still blowing bubbles into the monetary system. During this time, in the new era of unbundled fees, Delta has booked RECORD profits. They will likely continue to be profitable to some degree.
Bar, haven't studied it lately, been very preoccupied. Does Delta make much if any operational profit currently? It was my understanding that in 2011 they made $937M in baggage fees alone.
Point is, this trend is growing and will continue as they find more fees and extras that they will sell to the traveller. Yes, management might drag this out. If they do, remember they are doing so because it is good business for them to do so. No big deal. As long as we are vocal, firm, and conduct our selves in the same manner, and pursue our goals that are good business for us.
So perhaps constructive engagement is gone. Perhaps that is not such a bad thing at all.
11-18-2013, 08:15 PM
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For all of you history buffs out there:
150 years ago today, Abraham Lincoln delivered the Gettysburg Address.
Ok. Back to your regularly scheduled food fight.
150 years ago today, Abraham Lincoln delivered the Gettysburg Address.
Ok. Back to your regularly scheduled food fight.
11-18-2013, 08:29 PM
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So let me get this straight DPA has this down to a few pilots instead of reaching out to these pilots they turn it over to the FBI. How about a phone call to these guys with a simple cease and desist from TC or one of the other leaders. If you were able to narrow it down to pilots on layovers in ATL you could surely figure out how to reach them. A simple phone call stating that if this continues they will turn this over to the authorities would have stopped this.
Funny thing is TC had his but saved by the same organization he now vilifies. Can't wait to see how DPA handles a pilot who gets in trouble with management.
Funny thing is TC had his but saved by the same organization he now vilifies. Can't wait to see how DPA handles a pilot who gets in trouble with management.
11-18-2013, 08:44 PM
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We have lots of pilots screw up much worse than this on a regular basis. I can't ever recall a situation where the pilot was made to publicly confess his sin to the world. My reference to professional standards was my roundabout way of saying there might be a more constructive way to handle it than "accept my demand or I'm turning you over to the FBI." What if the next time Tim decides to call the FAA because one of our pilots had a deviation. In my mine its the same idea. Not saying the individual (if he actually exists) was right and that he shouldn't apologize. I'm just saying Tim was awfully quick to escalate this thing.
All that said, given what I've seen of the crew van news updates recently, I'm skeptical that everything in today's update is squeaky clean. In fact, I'm suspicious that some of it is downright fabricated.
Time will tell, but I sense this is shaping up to be another DPA folly.
All that said, given what I've seen of the crew van news updates recently, I'm skeptical that everything in today's update is squeaky clean. In fact, I'm suspicious that some of it is downright fabricated.
Time will tell, but I sense this is shaping up to be another DPA folly.
Leine,
I agree, time well tell. No use speculating. This will be very interesting one way or another.
Scoop
11-18-2013, 08:55 PM
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This is an excerpt from the last Crew Van News on 11/15. Bolded part is my highlight:
Ignoring the dramatic closing quote, it seems that Tim already forgot what he wrote last Friday. The entire piece tries to paint the picture that we should be forgiving of this individual. He even finishes with a little foreshadowing that "it depends on whether or not we can resolve the situation peacefully and ensure it doesn't happen again."
I guess an alleged personal call wasn't enough to satisfy Tim's bloodlust for ALPA. He demanded a public shaming instead, and has now chosen to put the Feds "on the case."
Is that about right Carl? Just want to make sure I'm getting this correctly.
Ignoring the dramatic closing quote, it seems that Tim already forgot what he wrote last Friday. The entire piece tries to paint the picture that we should be forgiving of this individual. He even finishes with a little foreshadowing that "it depends on whether or not we can resolve the situation peacefully and ensure it doesn't happen again."
I guess an alleged personal call wasn't enough to satisfy Tim's bloodlust for ALPA. He demanded a public shaming instead, and has now chosen to put the Feds "on the case."
Is that about right Carl? Just want to make sure I'm getting this correctly.
As for those trying to draw comparisons of how this action (allegedly) isn't worse than what some pilots have done and not been sought out for, well, can you give me an example? Where has a pilot received forgiveness for intentionally going out of his way with action with the intent to cause harm and financial costs to another party? I'm not saying it hasn't happened (an attack forgiven and everyone walks away friends again), but I have never heard of anything like that here.
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