DARR31

I love those early AM ones too. Capt once asked me to make one in the early AM and I told him I would not since the folks were probably sleeping or watching TV and his reply was "If I have to be awake, so do they". So after his 5 min PA, I think they were all awake!

Bucking Bar

Gunship Guy,

Just speaking for myself, you write like a man with nearly no understanding of the process. You've not been interested in learning and have not volunteered (going on your statement, I do not know you).

The reality is Delta is our employer. You seem to recognize the mutually beneficial situation we have here; Delta does well, we do well. Delta management sits on the other side of the table, but they are not the enemy unless the situation calls for us to treat them as such. Since we work for Delta, attacking them ends up harming us over the long run.

So the best way to advocate for you is a series of very measured actions. Trying to take ground where we can, trying not to set off an all out war. A peaceful partnership that benefits both sides is optimum and that is where both sides try to keep the peace.

We maintain situational awareness by looking out the window at the other reference points. Which of those other airlines would you prefer to work for, other than Delta, and why? Is the reason you would perfer to work for another carrier based on anything your union has done, or has not done? Or are they in a different business, like cargo. Objectively, I look out the window and Delta is, at least in my mind, the #1 job with the #1 pay in the passenger business.

Yes, my career has stagnated horribly. We merged and I've not yet recovered, but, wasn't that management's call? ALPA got me quite a substantial pay raise, stock and improved my contract. ALPA did it through partnership more than combativeness. As a result, not only is our pay near the top, but our airline is growing and the best competitor I've ever seen in the marketplace.

ALPA will absolutely work to make things better. Their work never stops. As we type they are working on optimizing FAR 117 for us, they are trying to get more flying for us on the Virgin JV and they are helping indviduals with many myriad issues that nobody talks about.

Richard Anderson was an attorney under Frank Lorenzo. He has seen labor wars fought, and his side won. Continental is still here and the Eastern pilots mostly exited the profession. He is a very smart man who sees the value of working together.

I'm not sure what kind of emotional speach to the troops you are wanting your union to create; we actually get better results by taking these skirmishes on one by one and winning.

Of course, if you are frustrated by the lack of progress, grab a corner and lift. There are always opportunities to serve.

Respectfully, BB

Carl Spackler

You've been saying this dismissive stuff since we had 500 cards. Now we have over 5,000 and you're still dismissing the obvious.

I don't know if DPA will ultimately win. Neither do you despite your predictions to the contrary. And no matter how many times you say: "AIN'T GONNA HAPPEN".

DALPA's Secret Police is being funded by over $80,000 of dues money and climbing. If the DPA really "ain't gonna happen", why waste the dues money?

Carl

Carl Spackler

Just out of curiosity, does this kind of kindergarten stuff work to shut people up in the DALPA echo chamber?

Carl

hoserpilot

That's funny. Your the one with the reading comprehension problem. I quote you and you claim no such thing. Maybe you should read exactly what you wrote. You just hit a nerve the last few days. You are a cancer to DPA. Listen here "ace", I'm not trying to shut you up. I asked Tim to organize the mouthpieces on the Internet and keep them professional. You sir are a cancer to the drive. Your the one with pages and pages of emotional tantrums.

hoserpilot

Do constantly have to belittle people? Kindergarten.

Carl Spackler

Yeah, that'll work good.

Straw man argument. Nobody but you is calling them the enemy or advocating attacking them. Why are you advocating attacking them and calling them the enemy Bar?

No, the best way is to have a union that doesn't speak on management's behalf. We advocate to lead the industry, they advocate "industry standard." We make our case that we can lead the industry because our sacrifices have now created Delta's leading financial state. If management refuses Delta pilots leading the industry, we strike as a last resort. If you're not willing to do that, you are essentially a non-union employee. Many of us don't want a pretend union Bar.

Carl

Carl Spackler

No you don't quote me. You choose to mischaracterize instead. Do you know how to quote people Hoser? It's easy to do, and you'd be able to make your case...if you had a case.

Carl

Elliot

This statement, right here, is what I'm talking about Carl. You keep embarrassing yourself with thinly veiled justifications of why the DPA "should keep going, keep forging forward."

Your a numbers guy, you know statistics. You know it's taken almost three years to get 5000 cards (not even 50% of the seniority list), and realize that it could take ANOTHER three years to get the required amount of cards to call for a vote. Or, in another three years, you'll still be sitting at 5000 cards because no one else is signing up, & quite frankly, the ones who did sign up, are seeing it as a fruitless effort & not renewing.

We discussed this very issue around page 9000 of this thread. Go take a look.

The truly "SAD" part about it Carl, is the DPA has ALREADY lost. (Even more sad that you don't understand that.) Not in terms of a vote, or awakening ALPA/D-ALPA, but in terms of dividing this pilot group during the last Section 6 negotiations, AND they're willing to do it again (just because they can), in another 4.5 months when we exchange openers with the company again.

First of all, leave the "Secret Police" name calling BS at home. It lends so much more credence to your DPA fervor when your not slinging names & insults.

Secondly, D-ALPA realizes how the DPA has divided the pilot group. They also realize that we have Section 6 openers due in another 4.5 months. If you were going out on a first date in 4.5 months (Section 6 opener), would you too want to get the lice (DPA) out of your hair?

tomgoodman

IMHO, the Delta "dinosaur culture" was not the work of Janus, but of Woolman, Dolson, and Garrett. Our dinosaur brothers at NWA told us that things were quite different up north.