Any "Latest & Greatest" about Delta?
09-18-2013, 04:12 AM
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Jan 2011
Posts: 403
From ALPA: "Additionally, we will engage in discretionary negotiations when opportunities arise that may lead to improvements in the pay, working conditions, retirement or job security of the Delta pilots, such as is occurring with Asia/Pacific scope."
Sounds like we are being set up for another scope sale. "Ok, you can violate the Asia/Pacific scope clause, but you have to give us ------." Fill in the blank - it does not matter with what. That is another scope sale and will lead to more stagnation. In a lot of ways, I wish ALPA would just leave our contract alone. Nearly all of these "opportunities" have led to givebacks, and the company is just better at negotiating than we are. Fooling ALPA into feeling like pseudo-managers is one of the smartest things the company can do. Using our own bargaining agent to sell us things...brilliant. Since we lose most of the time at the table, I'd rather just stay away from it. Kinda like house odds in Vegas.
Sounds like we are being set up for another scope sale. "Ok, you can violate the Asia/Pacific scope clause, but you have to give us ------." Fill in the blank - it does not matter with what. That is another scope sale and will lead to more stagnation. In a lot of ways, I wish ALPA would just leave our contract alone. Nearly all of these "opportunities" have led to givebacks, and the company is just better at negotiating than we are. Fooling ALPA into feeling like pseudo-managers is one of the smartest things the company can do. Using our own bargaining agent to sell us things...brilliant. Since we lose most of the time at the table, I'd rather just stay away from it. Kinda like house odds in Vegas.
09-18-2013, 04:13 AM
Can't abide NAI
Joined APC: Jun 2007
Position: Douglas Aerospace post production Flight Test & Work Around Engineering bulletin dissembler
Posts: 12,038
Vikz09,
All this started with the Pinnacle bargaining that I raised concerns about here. Bargaining which threw half the industry into concessions and for which not a single Rep has been recalled, nor a single resolution passed.
Lets begin with the recognition that the express carriers involved are owned subsidiaries of parent corporations earning hundreds of millions of dollars in profits. These are not bankrupt carriers in the sense we are used to. They are alter-ego entities within a brand and management is playing the oldest game in the pilot labor book, whipsaw.
Just like Lorenzo shut down Eastern and transferred assets to Continental, management today is threatening to shut down and transfer jobs. MEC Chairmen have a choice, whether to take a hit for the profession, or save their pilots' jobs to fight another day. Thus far, everyone is choosing to save their own skin. Thus far, that has been a local decision and ALPA National has supported those decisions.
These are not easy decisions. President Moak could refuse to authorize, or ratify, these concessionary contracts ... the result (particularly at US Air) could well be the rapid end of those pilots' jobs which would draw an immediate lawsuit against ALPA. Worse, the economic fate of the Eagle pilots may be a certainty regardless of what ALPA does (as it was with Comair to some extent) in which case ALPA gets sued for something that was going to happen anyway.
(moral of the story ... make sure your paycheck, the name on the side of the airplane & your paycheck are the same thing)
Another part of the puzzle is the direction we line guys are giving to National. The absence of any response, official or informal, from any MEC, following the Pinnacle negotiations tells me that factually, there is tacit agreement with the Pinnacle negotiation. So, that's on ALPA's membership, not the union. Nobody over there is doing anything to call national to account for this predatory bargaining.
President Moak's letter makes sense. The way I read it, he takes a position not unlike the position he took here. Survive the crisis and fight another day. He's betting economics will change the situation, making for a better negotiating environment in the future. He has a good track record for betting correctly on the economics.
Hey, I really wish we (as a profession) were fighting alter ego whipsaw. The last time we tried, President Woerth refused to sign the CC Air contract and CC Air ceased to exist. The pilots were merged in within their parent airline (Mesa) which was a bit of a precedent ... a merger for pilots who's airline had ceased operations ... but it was the right thing to do in order to prevent the larger disaster of alter ego whipsaw resulting in endless concessionary bargaining.
All this started with the Pinnacle bargaining that I raised concerns about here. Bargaining which threw half the industry into concessions and for which not a single Rep has been recalled, nor a single resolution passed.
Lets begin with the recognition that the express carriers involved are owned subsidiaries of parent corporations earning hundreds of millions of dollars in profits. These are not bankrupt carriers in the sense we are used to. They are alter-ego entities within a brand and management is playing the oldest game in the pilot labor book, whipsaw.
Just like Lorenzo shut down Eastern and transferred assets to Continental, management today is threatening to shut down and transfer jobs. MEC Chairmen have a choice, whether to take a hit for the profession, or save their pilots' jobs to fight another day. Thus far, everyone is choosing to save their own skin. Thus far, that has been a local decision and ALPA National has supported those decisions.
These are not easy decisions. President Moak could refuse to authorize, or ratify, these concessionary contracts ... the result (particularly at US Air) could well be the rapid end of those pilots' jobs which would draw an immediate lawsuit against ALPA. Worse, the economic fate of the Eagle pilots may be a certainty regardless of what ALPA does (as it was with Comair to some extent) in which case ALPA gets sued for something that was going to happen anyway.
(moral of the story ... make sure your paycheck, the name on the side of the airplane & your paycheck are the same thing)
Another part of the puzzle is the direction we line guys are giving to National. The absence of any response, official or informal, from any MEC, following the Pinnacle negotiations tells me that factually, there is tacit agreement with the Pinnacle negotiation. So, that's on ALPA's membership, not the union. Nobody over there is doing anything to call national to account for this predatory bargaining.
President Moak's letter makes sense. The way I read it, he takes a position not unlike the position he took here. Survive the crisis and fight another day. He's betting economics will change the situation, making for a better negotiating environment in the future. He has a good track record for betting correctly on the economics.
Hey, I really wish we (as a profession) were fighting alter ego whipsaw. The last time we tried, President Woerth refused to sign the CC Air contract and CC Air ceased to exist. The pilots were merged in within their parent airline (Mesa) which was a bit of a precedent ... a merger for pilots who's airline had ceased operations ... but it was the right thing to do in order to prevent the larger disaster of alter ego whipsaw resulting in endless concessionary bargaining.
Last edited by Bucking Bar; 09-18-2013 at 04:33 AM.
09-18-2013, 04:38 AM
Can't abide NAI
Joined APC: Jun 2007
Position: Douglas Aerospace post production Flight Test & Work Around Engineering bulletin dissembler
Posts: 12,038
From ALPA: "Additionally, we will engage in discretionary negotiations when opportunities arise that may lead to improvements in the pay, working conditions, retirement or job security of the Delta pilots, such as is occurring with Asia/Pacific scope."
Sounds like we are being set up for another scope sale. "Ok, you can violate the Asia/Pacific scope clause, but you have to give us ------." Fill in the blank -
.... In a lot of ways, I wish ALPA would just leave our contract alone. Nearly all of these "opportunities" have led to givebacks, and the company is just better at negotiating than we are.
Sounds like we are being set up for another scope sale. "Ok, you can violate the Asia/Pacific scope clause, but you have to give us ------." Fill in the blank -
.... In a lot of ways, I wish ALPA would just leave our contract alone. Nearly all of these "opportunities" have led to givebacks, and the company is just better at negotiating than we are.
The Narita piece just isn't that much to work with. The Company may just accept enforcement of our contract as written. I'll post some numbers later today if they were published publically. Those numbers have been reviewed in the open in Council meetings.
09-18-2013, 05:16 AM
Can't abide NAI
Joined APC: Jun 2007
Position: Douglas Aerospace post production Flight Test & Work Around Engineering bulletin dissembler
Posts: 12,038
Flyz,
Based on the 6 June 13 Delta MEC Alert publication:
Less than 1% isn't much. The Company's response has been to overfly Japan from Seattle which adds more block hours, which benefits us (I hope they make money). Our MEC's first proposal for the scope problem was a scope solution, a global production balance. You would have to call your Rep to see if anything has transpired since then.
Wonder if Fukishima's disaster is effecting this? My wife wants to vacation in Asia. I'm saying no to taking our kids through Tokyo.
Based on the 6 June 13 Delta MEC Alert publication:
....foreign codeshare partners currently carry less than 1% of the passengers that transit NRT with DL code on their itinerary. Approximately 93% of the transiting passengers fly exclusively on Delta mainline flights, and approximately 6% will transit by connecting to an interline carrier’s flight.
Wonder if Fukishima's disaster is effecting this? My wife wants to vacation in Asia. I'm saying no to taking our kids through Tokyo.
09-18-2013, 05:33 AM
veut gagner à la loterie
Joined APC: Apr 2008
Position: Light Chop
Posts: 23,286
09-18-2013, 05:35 AM
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Nov 2009
Position: C560XL/XLS/XLS+
Posts: 1,278
Flyz,
Based on the 6 June 13 Delta MEC Alert publication:
Less than 1% isn't much. The Company's response has been to overfly Japan from Seattle which adds more block hours, which benefits us (I hope they make money). Our MEC's first proposal for the scope problem was a scope solution, a global production balance. You would have to call your Rep to see if anything has transpired since then.
Wonder if Fukishima's disaster is effecting this? My wife wants to vacation in Asia. I'm saying no to taking our kids through Tokyo.
Based on the 6 June 13 Delta MEC Alert publication:
Less than 1% isn't much. The Company's response has been to overfly Japan from Seattle which adds more block hours, which benefits us (I hope they make money). Our MEC's first proposal for the scope problem was a scope solution, a global production balance. You would have to call your Rep to see if anything has transpired since then.
Wonder if Fukishima's disaster is effecting this? My wife wants to vacation in Asia. I'm saying no to taking our kids through Tokyo.
09-18-2013, 05:41 AM
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Dec 2009
Position: Capt
Posts: 2,049
Bar, the 10 new 330's were not purchased for the Asia operation. I was told that 777 time was going to be moved into SEA for the purpose of over flying NRT. I think NRT is dead, JMHO. The 330's are going to be used to replace the 777 flying as much as possible, and to further our expansion into deep South America. Look for more frequencies to Brazil if we get permission.
09-18-2013, 05:54 AM
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Nov 2009
Position: C560XL/XLS/XLS+
Posts: 1,278
I always love how some DAL guys just love to say "NRT is dead". No clue of the actual economics, treaties, pacts, efficiencies, history, loyalty. Just, it was NWA's, so let's hope it goes away. Stupid. Do you have any clue how many pilot jobs would be lost if the operation went away. Be careful what you "hope" for.
09-18-2013, 06:05 AM
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Dec 2009
Position: Capt
Posts: 2,049
09-18-2013, 06:34 AM
Can't abide NAI
Joined APC: Jun 2007
Position: Douglas Aerospace post production Flight Test & Work Around Engineering bulletin dissembler
Posts: 12,038
Originally Posted by Mr. Robert Alvarez, former Senior Policy Adviser to the Secretary and Deputy Assistant Secretary for National Security and the Environment at the U.S. Department of Energy
In recent times, more information about the spent fuel situation at the Fukushima-Dai-Ichi site has become known. It is my understanding that of the 1,532 spent fuel assemblies in reactor No. 304 assemblies are fresh and unirradiated. This then leaves 1,231 irradiated spent fuel rods in pool No. 4, which contain roughly 37 million curies (~1.4E+18 Becquerel) of long-lived radioactivity. The No. 4 pool is about 100 feet above ground, is structurally damaged and is exposed to the open elements. If an earthquake or other event were to cause this pool to drain this could result in a catastrophic radiological fire involving nearly 10 times the amount of Cs-137 released by the Chernobyl accident.
The infrastructure to safely remove this material was destroyed as it was at the other three reactors. Spent reactor fuel cannot be simply lifted into the air by a crane as if it were routine cargo. In order to prevent severe radiation exposures, fires and possible explosions, it must be transferred at all times in water and heavily shielded structures into dry casks.. As this has never been done before, the removal of the spent fuel from the pools at the damaged Fukushima-Dai-Ichi reactors will require a major and time-consuming re-construction effort and will be charting in unknown waters. Despite the enormous destruction cased at the Da–Ichi site, dry casks holding a smaller amount of spent fuel appear to be unscathed.
Based on U.S. Energy Department data, assuming a total of 11,138 spent fuel assemblies are being stored at the Dai-Ichi site, nearly all, which is in pools. They contain roughly 336 million curies (~1.2 E+19 Bq) of long-lived radioactivity. About 134 million curies is Cesium-137 — roughly 85 times the amount of Cs-137 released at the Chernobyl accident as estimated by the U.S. National Council on Radiation Protection (NCRP). The total spent reactor fuel inventory at the Fukushima-Daichi site contains nearly half of the total amount of Cs-137 estimated by the NCRP to have been released by all atmospheric nuclear weapons testing, Chernobyl, and world-wide reprocessing plants (~270 million curies or ~9.9 E+18 Becquerel).
It is important for the public to understand that reactors that have been operating for decades, such as those at the Fukushima-Dai-Ichi site have generated some of the largest concentrations of radioactivity on the planet.
Many of our readers might find it difficult to appreciate the actual meaning of the figure, yet we can grasp what 85 times more Cesium-137 than the Chernobyl would mean. It would destroy the world environment and our civilization. This is not rocket science, nor does it connect to the pugilistic debate over nuclear power plants. This is an issue of human survival.
The infrastructure to safely remove this material was destroyed as it was at the other three reactors. Spent reactor fuel cannot be simply lifted into the air by a crane as if it were routine cargo. In order to prevent severe radiation exposures, fires and possible explosions, it must be transferred at all times in water and heavily shielded structures into dry casks.. As this has never been done before, the removal of the spent fuel from the pools at the damaged Fukushima-Dai-Ichi reactors will require a major and time-consuming re-construction effort and will be charting in unknown waters. Despite the enormous destruction cased at the Da–Ichi site, dry casks holding a smaller amount of spent fuel appear to be unscathed.
Based on U.S. Energy Department data, assuming a total of 11,138 spent fuel assemblies are being stored at the Dai-Ichi site, nearly all, which is in pools. They contain roughly 336 million curies (~1.2 E+19 Bq) of long-lived radioactivity. About 134 million curies is Cesium-137 — roughly 85 times the amount of Cs-137 released at the Chernobyl accident as estimated by the U.S. National Council on Radiation Protection (NCRP). The total spent reactor fuel inventory at the Fukushima-Daichi site contains nearly half of the total amount of Cs-137 estimated by the NCRP to have been released by all atmospheric nuclear weapons testing, Chernobyl, and world-wide reprocessing plants (~270 million curies or ~9.9 E+18 Becquerel).
It is important for the public to understand that reactors that have been operating for decades, such as those at the Fukushima-Dai-Ichi site have generated some of the largest concentrations of radioactivity on the planet.
Many of our readers might find it difficult to appreciate the actual meaning of the figure, yet we can grasp what 85 times more Cesium-137 than the Chernobyl would mean. It would destroy the world environment and our civilization. This is not rocket science, nor does it connect to the pugilistic debate over nuclear power plants. This is an issue of human survival.
We do know that many nuclear experts called for the evacuation of Tokyo, including TEPCO's. The response of the Japanese government was that the Japanese government would likely fail and the nation descend into disorder if they closed their Capital. As you might guess, that would mostly end Japan flying but for relief charters.
Very interesting read:
http://www.nap.edu/openbook.php?record_id=11263&page=38
The threat considered here was a terrorist attack. The science is valid, regardless of how the storage pools fail.
There is no consensus on the severity of this threat. Some say Robert Alvarez's post above is overblown. We probably don't know what this sort of mass exposure does.
Last edited by Bucking Bar; 09-18-2013 at 07:11 AM.
Thread
Thread Starter
Forum
Replies
Last Post
