Any "Latest & Greatest" about Delta?
08-15-2013, 05:50 PM
Looking for a laugh
Joined APC: Feb 2008
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08-15-2013, 05:56 PM
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Jul 2007
Position: Road construction signholder
Posts: 2,433
If DALPA (with ALPA support) can look in the mirror and think they did a "good job" with the last contract then I am TERRIFIED of our next contract negations.
I am TERRIFIED to see what DALPA will give up in the next contract for a cost of living pay increase.
Let's face it....DALPA (with ALPA support) brought a knife to a gunfight.
TERRIFIED of the next round of contract talks.
And btw, not sure if it's true the company offered a "zero percent pay raise" but if that really happened the lead of the Negotiating Committee should have stood up and said "Then we are done here. We will prepare to strike. Call me if you'd like to negotiate, here's my cell number".
I am TERRIFIED to see what DALPA will give up in the next contract for a cost of living pay increase.
Let's face it....DALPA (with ALPA support) brought a knife to a gunfight.
TERRIFIED of the next round of contract talks.
And btw, not sure if it's true the company offered a "zero percent pay raise" but if that really happened the lead of the Negotiating Committee should have stood up and said "Then we are done here. We will prepare to strike. Call me if you'd like to negotiate, here's my cell number".
That doesn't mean that we should have ratified the last contract, though I admit I voted for it. It was a decent agreement, not great. Perhaps we should have walked away, I still haven't figured it out.
But the company would know in a nanosecond that some foolhardy statement of "we will prepare to strike" as we walked away from negotiations that were early and far outside the traditional Section 6 would be nothing but feel-good bluster.
Save the feel-good bluster for the forums of the world.
08-15-2013, 06:02 PM
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Position: Road construction signholder
Posts: 2,433
The contract wasn't concessionary overall, but a lot of concessions were made- way more than should have been. I consider it a poor and rushed final product after years of concessions and lost retirements. ADG is low enough as it is (should be 5:15 with no carve out), I seriously doubt they would have dumped LAX if it weren't for the carve out. That stuff was just saying yes to get a quick deal.
Yes, I would like to see the ADG raised to 5.15 a day as well, but Rome wasn't built in a day, especially considering we have never had it before.
Further, if we had the ADG raised to 5.15 a day, with no carve out for late sign ins, do you really think the company would structure the trips as they currently exist, with no changes, such that a LAX-GUA-LAX trip that currently pays 11 hours would miraculously be worth 15.45? Uh, no. Those trips would probably go back to ATL as part of a four or five day trip. Ditto for about any LAX redeye that signs in after 2200.
Then, as you know, the LAX guys would be upset that a lot of "their" flying was being flown by other bases.
Bottom line is that nothing in life is for free, and even good changes (ADG for all trips, no carveouts, worth 5.15 daily) sometimes have unintended side effects.
08-15-2013, 06:07 PM
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Joined APC: Aug 2007
Posts: 328
STRIKE??? Ah hah hah hah hah! Do you even realize we were in EARLY contract negotiations? Do you even realize that had we not reached an agreement that we would just now be in the BEGINNING of traditional section 6 negotiations? And that even if the NLRB and/or Obama administration allowed us to strike (questionable assumption at best) that it would be years from now?
That doesn't mean that we should have ratified the last contract, though I admit I voted for it. It was a decent agreement, not great. Perhaps we should have walked away, I still haven't figured it out.
But the company would know in a nanosecond that some foolhardy statement of "we will prepare to strike" as we walked away from negotiations that were early and far outside the traditional Section 6 would be nothing but feel-good bluster.
Save the feel-good bluster for the forums of the world.
That doesn't mean that we should have ratified the last contract, though I admit I voted for it. It was a decent agreement, not great. Perhaps we should have walked away, I still haven't figured it out.
But the company would know in a nanosecond that some foolhardy statement of "we will prepare to strike" as we walked away from negotiations that were early and far outside the traditional Section 6 would be nothing but feel-good bluster.
Save the feel-good bluster for the forums of the world.
Doesn't change the fact that I am really scared about what DALPA will give up in the next round of negotiations in order to get a cost of living adjustment to pay.
08-15-2013, 06:12 PM
Da Hudge
Joined APC: Oct 2006
Position: Poodle Whisperer
Posts: 17,473
Hard to say. For the naysayers, we have only had ADG since this contract was ratified. Ask all the junior ATL 7ER guys flying UIO if ADG is too low. A trip that used to pay 10.50 or so now pays 13.30, every time.
Yes, I would like to see the ADG raised to 5.15 a day as well, but Rome wasn't built in a day, especially considering we have never had it before.
Further, if we had the ADG raised to 5.15 a day, with no carve out for late sign ins, do you really think the company would structure the trips as they currently exist, with no changes, such that a LAX-GUA-LAX trip that currently pays 11 hours would miraculously be worth 15.45? Uh, no. Those trips would probably go back to ATL as part of a four or five day trip. Ditto for about any LAX redeye that signs in after 2200.
Then, as you know, the LAX guys would be upset that a lot of "their" flying was being flown by other bases.
Bottom line is that nothing in life is for free, and even good changes (ADG for all trips, no carveouts, worth 5.15 daily) sometimes have unintended side effects.
Yes, I would like to see the ADG raised to 5.15 a day as well, but Rome wasn't built in a day, especially considering we have never had it before.
Further, if we had the ADG raised to 5.15 a day, with no carve out for late sign ins, do you really think the company would structure the trips as they currently exist, with no changes, such that a LAX-GUA-LAX trip that currently pays 11 hours would miraculously be worth 15.45? Uh, no. Those trips would probably go back to ATL as part of a four or five day trip. Ditto for about any LAX redeye that signs in after 2200.
Then, as you know, the LAX guys would be upset that a lot of "their" flying was being flown by other bases.
Bottom line is that nothing in life is for free, and even good changes (ADG for all trips, no carveouts, worth 5.15 daily) sometimes have unintended side effects.
Yes, the ADG is a bit better than what it used to be, but like all the other improvements on the contract, mediocre at best.
08-15-2013, 06:13 PM
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08-15-2013, 06:16 PM
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Jun 2008
Posts: 3,716
Now I know why it's the MD90
90+ db's on climbout!
08-15-2013, 06:21 PM
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Position: MD-88 F/O
Posts: 1,004
In Honor Of All My Reserve Bros...
08-15-2013, 07:54 PM
Doing Nothing
Joined APC: Aug 2010
Posts: 1,316
Baja my last year on the 7ER was reserve and al I flew were the 10hr OGG and GUA... I hated them but then just got used to them! Especially all the guns in GUA on the streets and shady characters running around! But the food at that tree house place was good and it was cheap!!! Just wear running shoes and zig zag all the way back to the hotel!!!
Fiig
Fiig
08-15-2013, 08:47 PM
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Joined APC: Nov 2005
Position: Driving to work & Looking Left @ the Surf!!
Posts: 727
Baja my last year on the 7ER was reserve and al I flew were the 10hr OGG and GUA... I hated them but then just got used to them! Especially all the guns in GUA on the streets and shady characters running around! But the food at that tree house place was good and it was cheap!!! Just wear running shoes and zig zag all the way back to the hotel!!!
Fiig
Fiig
But back to the topic. I've heard that LAX runs 70%+ off the late night all-nighters. And this is where the ADG comes in. If this trip left earlier it would be worth 13:00 not 10:30 for the same trip. Maybe move this up on the next PWA?
Baja.
BTW - Where did you go Fiig? Or are you still here?
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