Purple Drank

For crying out loud.
Why do we contribute our dues money to help them undercut us? How does that make any sense whatsoever?

Rather B Fishin

Serious question. What "massive" amount of money will we have if ALPA is tossed? All the services we would need to contract out cost money. Law suits cost money. Without an assessment or increase in dues there's no way an in house union could get off the ground.

Sink r8

I'm going to take a risk and not ignore this, assuming you're going to discuss instead of lecture.

As far as I can tell, any under-cutting is self inflicted. They only exist inside our Scope exceptions. They can't be blamed, with some exceptions, the most glaring of which was the RJDC. I don't really believe that the RJDC was not tacitly supported by the respective MEC's. Another exception has been described fairly convincingly by Bar.

With all that being said, you can't show me that the dues money has been used to improve their situation at our expense, except than to provide basic services. My dues money might be partly subsidizing an RJ guy's access to insurance or aeromedical services? I'm OK with it. On the flip side, we lobby as one group, and for the most part, they don't get anything we don't actually give up first. They mostly sit here, waiting for an opportunity to escape to greener pastures, and usually don't make a convincing play for our positions. I'm actually sort of surprised they're happy with the current arrangement, because I really wonder if it favors them at all.

I realize this is heresy for most pilots, and really violates the dogmas of the DPA, and I'm going to burn in hell for it, but... If you take a dispassionate look at it, we're getting trounced by management, while keeping the RJ guys pretty much in purgatory below us. I've often wondered why we don't have a union for the majors, and one for the regionals. I like the idea a lot, and I'm sure CAPA would like it, but somehow no one is doing that. Why?

It's easy to envision a world where a RAPLA would be suing a MALPA everywhere, every day, and trying to abolish our exclusive contracts on the legislative front.

Just my own, unorthodox, Machiavellian musings, of course.

hornetsnest

It's a valid question. USAir Easties have been the lowest paid since they bailed in 2004. They still pay 1.95% and have a bunch of assesments. A couple of million extra per year. They have to be the closest example of leaving except they took the same structure with them and didn't start from scratch. If you look at the DPA constitution it says immediate certification dues redcuction to 1.75% except that they can go up an extra 0.5% for merger or section 6 or bankruptcy. If the vote came and they won we would be entering a section 6 soon so DPA dues would be 2.25% until it's complete and then they would refund leftovers or give it to a charity. If it happened and if USAPA is any indicator of a merger combined with a section 6 we could be paying 2.25% for 10 years APA is pushing 10 years on their last contract as well. At least the DPA isn't hiding the fact that dues will go up.

Hawaii50

I've always liked the idea of a MALPA as well. I think we're a lot better together than we would be on our own. Might even attract an AA or a SWA down the road. We'd be a powerful force.

Not sure if regionals sueing to abolish exclusive contracts would ever have merit. They are after all, outsourced labor, flying our companies customers. And...we'd have plenty of money relative to them to fight off any attempt.

That said, the last thing I'd want to do is take food out of the mouths of people already making little in many cases. I just think it's in the best interest of all of us to work toward minimizing regional flying and bringing more jobs back to mainline.

Sink r8

All makes sense.

With respect to the middle part, I haven't given a lot of thought, but I wasn't thinking lawsuits. I was thinking something like the wrong mood in congress, an unsympathetic Supreme Court... one group makes a play to change the laws relative to exclusive contracts, backed up by industry lobby. Who knows? What made wonder was airlines in Europe, like Aer Lingus doing wet-lease stuff for Virgin Atlantic, for example. Those guys have unions, and they have contracts. I don't know if they have Scope, but it doesn't seem like they have Scope the way we understand it. Hell, I was once told that Air France has seven pilot unions. How does that work?

I could be off the reservation completely on this one. I just remember I came from a regional, and it was a crap regional. We brought in ALPA just as I started. We kept slugging it out with the company, but the thought never once occurred to us to make a direct play for the major's flying. Just droning along, going deaf on PT-6 noise, and hoping, one day, to escape.

I didn't really think we were screwing the Delta guys by having access to Aeromedical. I just wanted to be there (here), and for the majors to shut down the regional loophell we were living in.

Dorfman

Scheduling Question

If I do a personal drop for a trip NOT an authorized PD can I white slip a different trip that touches those days.

Sink r8

99% sure you cannot.

LeineLodge

I'm 99% sure you CAN.

To satisfy that 1% chance, call ALPA tomorrow. You're paying for tr service and they can answer that in about 2 seconds. Alternatively your rep may be able to give you a quick answer if you're wanting to get in before the 2200E or 0700E PCS runs.

TeddyKGB

Did it a couple times last month. You can.