johnso29

Well, if Moak breaks again then I guess they could. But not before that.

Boomer

But the big problem with 1113c is that you don't give it away, it is taken away.

So say Delta files ch11 again, all Delta has to do is demonstrate to the judge that Republic flies 100-seat jets for a given (lower) pay scale, and show that if Delta pilots are lowered to Republic pay, or some Connection carrier takes the planes, Delta can emerge from BK successfully. If the judge is convinced, bye bye scope.

This is what Delta did to Comair's ALPA pilots in 2006- they presented the other DCI carriers lower payscales and testified that Comair could win more Delta flying if the judge threw out our payscale and workrules. The judge found the testimony "compelling" and ruled with Delta.

As Delta and ALPA have already fought this battle and Delta won, would the only solution be to stay out of bankruptcy?

Could the DALPA members on the BOD prevent Delta from 1113c'ing the Delta pilot group?

acl65pilot

Fact is that relaxing scope would have not worked the last time, so it would not work again.

Also, if you look at our pay, it is not that much different than the likes of RJET.

I am all for taking back flying. The rates are not that far apart, and if anyone has a economics or business background they would realize that the costs over a longer term will be cheaper at DAL.
Why?
It is a junior jet and the longevity range that would be flying it will continually be lower than that of a RJET. You may get more 320's etc, but the fact is that the 100 seater (190) is the top end and more than likely will remain that way. That means that you rates will continue to climb. Cost per block hr will go up, whereas, at DAL looking forward with retirements etc, the average pilot will be at the company less than 8 years sitting in the left seat. Not now, but in three to five years.

If you look at it from a cost standpoint and extrapolate it out over a 10-15 year life cycle span of the aircraft DAL will win hands down. Heck late in to the next the next decade they will probably be hiring in to the left seat as we retire 800+ a year.

Hawaii50

The difficult part of taking back flying is that we are only a small part of the equation. Across the board, FAs, Mechs, Agents etc it would be very expensive for the company to suddenly staff DCI flying with DL people. The company would have to have a good reason to it. Another reason to never give an inch more because it's damn near impossible to recover when you do.

acl65pilot

Funny thing is that for the most part the only services that are provided by the DCI operators are the Pilots, FA's, Mechanics, and Dispatch services. We are a small part of the equation. I agree with that. A ASA FA tops out at 30 bucks an hr. Now I am not sure where our FA's top out at but it is probably double that. As for the mechanics, they need to take a 10K pay cut from DCI to come over to DAL. It is that big. Thing is that DAL does a lot of the DCI mtc.

Now in reality there are more costs than just this, but all of them can be negated with the margins we are paying. This is 100's of millions of dollars a year. Fact is that DAL is in-sourcing for this very reason. It is in the long term cheaper to have this flying here at mainline than to outsource.
If you look at the years 2012-2030 many of those in the mainline workforce will be gone. The employee costs will be going way down. This cannot be said for DCI where many people, (not just pilots) have decided to make that airline their career. DCI is getting way to expensive. Management know this too.
Yes, one way to get costs down is to spread the costs over more seats. The temperature of the pilot group is no way no how, and they know it. Yes, they will continue to try, but in reality it will cost more to keep doing business this way.

Most of this flying would be done by the low rung employees anyway. They will be the cheapest and because of this, it will be very cost effective.

BigGuns

According to the CPO, this was from the JFK Roadshow in JFK on 8/27 and came from Steve Dickson. They also said the some of the flying will be in a shift of domestic flights from JFK to LGA. They also plan on being in the USAIR term by FEB 2010, subject to GOV approval. They said the side show and clip should be avalible on Delta Net soon.

acl65pilot

They need to be careful not to shift too much. If they do they will have no feed to those international flights.

GBU-24

Anybody....acl65...have an idea on how many 320s will replace the 90's in SLC. And was the previous post of a joint Jan AE for the 320 and 90 is true or just a good rumor to start?

acl65pilot

From what I can gather, it is going to be a total swap. I may wrong but that is the impression I got.

No these words are being spoken by the leaders on the joint base visits.

GBU-24

1 for 1 swap? Bigger base the currently?