Any "Latest & Greatest" about Delta?
11-06-2012, 07:45 AM
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Mar 2008
Posts: 3,858
Spout all the uninformed, inaccurate, and foolish things you want... It does not change the fact that you are NOT a Delta Pilot and you do NOT know "what the membership wants".
Why don't you go negotiate a solidly improved contract for your own airline before being critical of someone else's collective bargaining agreement...
If the membership was so dissatisfied with the work of THEIR own elected representatives, why hasn't even a single LEC had a recall petition submitted?
Why don't you go negotiate a solidly improved contract for your own airline before being critical of someone else's collective bargaining agreement...
If the membership was so dissatisfied with the work of THEIR own elected representatives, why hasn't even a single LEC had a recall petition submitted?
Get a resolution, ask for a special LEC meeting, stack the meeting with your buds, resolution passes, vote is carried out, and POOF. Probably less than 60 days start to finish, not including the election for the reps you just booted.
At a smaller base, 50 well motivated people can make it happen, no problem. Larger bases would take more, but not many more.
Nu
11-06-2012, 08:01 AM
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Dec 2009
Position: Capt
Posts: 2,049
Great point.
Yeah, if you thought the B717's were coming anyway, you got hoodwinked. Even though management told you that they were contingent on a deal, and that they had a plan B. Even though Allegiant signed a contract for about 1/3 the number of small narrowbody aircraft just weeks after ours passed. Hoodwinked! Management had a real world deadline to get started.
Yeah, if you thought the B717's were coming anyway, you got hoodwinked. Even though management told you that they were contingent on a deal, and that they had a plan B. Even though Allegiant signed a contract for about 1/3 the number of small narrowbody aircraft just weeks after ours passed. Hoodwinked! Management had a real world deadline to get started.
11-06-2012, 08:08 AM
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Feb 2008
Posts: 2,539
C'mon, man.
11-06-2012, 08:10 AM
Can't abide NAI
Joined APC: Jun 2007
Position: Douglas Aerospace post production Flight Test & Work Around Engineering bulletin dissembler
Posts: 12,014
Great point.
Yeah, if you thought the B717's were coming anyway, you got hoodwinked. Even though management told you that they were contingent on a deal, and that they had a plan B. Even though Allegiant signed a contract for about 1/3 the number of small narrowbody aircraft just weeks after ours passed. Hoodwinked! Management had a real world deadline to get started.
If you thought RJ50's were just going away on their own and DCI would get way smaller, even though ownership costs and lease obligations stretched into next decade, then you were hoodwinked. You were told that management had a plan B, and that they'd make the smartest financial decisions for the company, not for Delta pilots. And they had a real world deadline to get started.
But here in the real world, getting B717's, ensuring more Delta pax are flown by Delta pilots, and increasing pilot pay 12.84% on the amendable date and a bunch of other improvements were the reason that this was the right deal at the right time.
Yeah, if you thought the B717's were coming anyway, you got hoodwinked. Even though management told you that they were contingent on a deal, and that they had a plan B. Even though Allegiant signed a contract for about 1/3 the number of small narrowbody aircraft just weeks after ours passed. Hoodwinked! Management had a real world deadline to get started.
If you thought RJ50's were just going away on their own and DCI would get way smaller, even though ownership costs and lease obligations stretched into next decade, then you were hoodwinked. You were told that management had a plan B, and that they'd make the smartest financial decisions for the company, not for Delta pilots. And they had a real world deadline to get started.
But here in the real world, getting B717's, ensuring more Delta pax are flown by Delta pilots, and increasing pilot pay 12.84% on the amendable date and a bunch of other improvements were the reason that this was the right deal at the right time.
I thought you explained the 717's well when you related them to the somewhat unique opportunity presented by the structure of our network.
Our MEC did some outstanding work with C2012 and a lot of that was the result of good strategic thinking. Those who criticize C2012 argue vehemently that we left money on the table without seeming to correlate if we had managed to get every dime of profit then growth would be even further away than it is presently. (a lesson United learned the hard way)
Stagnation does suck, but I'd sure not trade this gig for any other US based passenger operator.
Any news on whether they will be ready by their delivery date? Frankly, it is surprising to see Delta and Southwest are playing so nicely in the sandbox. It is out of character for SWA.
11-06-2012, 08:13 AM
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Feb 2008
Posts: 2,539
I thought you explained the 717's well when you related them to the somewhat unique opportunity presented by the structure of our network.
Any news on whether they will be ready by their delivery date? Frankly, it is surprising to see Delta and Southwest are playing so nicely in the sandbox. It is out of character for SWA.
Any news on whether they will be ready by their delivery date? Frankly, it is surprising to see Delta and Southwest are playing so nicely in the sandbox. It is out of character for SWA.
11-06-2012, 08:45 AM
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Feb 2009
Position: right for a long, long time
Posts: 2,642
OK, thanks. But when you figured out the number of days on reserve under the old contract as 15 did you deduct the 2 days of CQ from 17? Or did you leave them in to get stay at 15. If you left them in because they're technically not removed then you're not really comparing apples to apples are you?
11-06-2012, 09:15 AM
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Feb 2009
Position: right for a long, long time
Posts: 2,642
This. LEC recalls are EXTREMELY easy to get going, and it doesn't take many angry people at all to get the ball rolling.
Get a resolution, ask for a special LEC meeting, stack the meeting with your buds, resolution passes, vote is carried out, and POOF. Probably less than 60 days start to finish, not including the election for the reps you just booted.
At a smaller base, 50 well motivated people can make it happen, no problem. Larger bases would take more, but not many more.
Nu
Get a resolution, ask for a special LEC meeting, stack the meeting with your buds, resolution passes, vote is carried out, and POOF. Probably less than 60 days start to finish, not including the election for the reps you just booted.
At a smaller base, 50 well motivated people can make it happen, no problem. Larger bases would take more, but not many more.
Nu
If there were that many unhappy Delta pilots in the real world it would have already happened.
11-06-2012, 09:15 AM
Can't abide NAI
Joined APC: Jun 2007
Position: Douglas Aerospace post production Flight Test & Work Around Engineering bulletin dissembler
Posts: 12,014
Hope the mods can see through this post and realize it is about economics, not politics ...
Given that hurricane Sandy may have provided a last minute campaign boost to the incumbent and robbed the challenger of valuable media opportunities; then forecasts are that GDP will be 1.25 to 1.5% higher due to economic certainty as well as continued income re-distribution to segments of our economy where those payments are instantly spent (as opposed to saved).
Anyone have any idea if Delta might have plans for a slightly better than expected 2013, which might mean a couple 757's sticking around with a few DC9's providing needed capacity? Or, is the current displacement malaise which lies over Atlanta like thick smog not likely to be blown out as a result of hurricane Sandy?
As a precaution, I'm locking in interest rates today.
Given that hurricane Sandy may have provided a last minute campaign boost to the incumbent and robbed the challenger of valuable media opportunities; then forecasts are that GDP will be 1.25 to 1.5% higher due to economic certainty as well as continued income re-distribution to segments of our economy where those payments are instantly spent (as opposed to saved).
Anyone have any idea if Delta might have plans for a slightly better than expected 2013, which might mean a couple 757's sticking around with a few DC9's providing needed capacity? Or, is the current displacement malaise which lies over Atlanta like thick smog not likely to be blown out as a result of hurricane Sandy?
As a precaution, I'm locking in interest rates today.
11-06-2012, 09:16 AM
seeing the large hubs...
Joined APC: Oct 2006
Position: 73N A
Posts: 3,716
11-06-2012, 09:29 AM
No longer cares
Joined APC: Mar 2008
Position: 767er Captain
Posts: 12,109
And the relevance of this is? We are getting 88 717s for a song... SWA is paying a ton of money to get rid of them.. to bring them up to our standards. Let's say that those 88 717s are costing us... oh.. and I am making this up... 200K/month to lease. How many new 319s do you think we can get for that amount of money? How many jobs will THAT translate into? If/when this group will ever get it's heads out of the sand and realize that management is gonna buy whatever size airplanes THEY see fit to buy, maybe our payscales will be rationalized to fit that a little better.... but I am not holding my breath.
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