Any "Latest & Greatest" about Delta?
06-28-2012, 11:58 AM
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Mar 2010
Position: SLC 767ER Captain
Posts: 602
Umm... unless they have changed this, there are no 7 short calls because they are ALWAYS on short call (promptly available) on their reserve days. Southwest is like this as well, a fact that the bemoaners of how miserable our reserve system is/will be conveniently omit when they point out that SWA reserves are "only" on call 15 days. I will gladly take the as low as 16 up to 18 days on call with only 6 or 7 short calls dependent on the ALV.
Also, would you rather have 85 hours pay at their ridiculous rates or 75.5 (average) at our rates? The grass is not always greener.
Also, would you rather have 85 hours pay at their ridiculous rates or 75.5 (average) at our rates? The grass is not always greener.
06-28-2012, 12:02 PM
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Jan 2006
Posts: 762
This sounds bogus to me. What is their regular line average 105 hours? So the reserve guys are going to get paid 1020 hours per year? 20 hours more than the domestic FAA limit. I would like to see that in writting. If this is true, which I am skeptical of, why would anyone even bid a regular line. If this is true, I may have to rethink my yes vote.
06-28-2012, 12:07 PM
Banned
Joined APC: Apr 2010
Posts: 394
06-28-2012, 12:18 PM
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Jul 2007
Position: Left seat of a little plane
Posts: 2,420
Since we are talking buying cars. So you walk in the dealership and say, that sticker price is a good deal. No you never take the first offer. If you buy the car and you and your salesman are buds at the end you got ripped off. Seems like DALPA likes being there buddy.
The better analogy would be after some torturous negotiating at the dealer you came out with the Passat and your wife was still upset about what you got.
That doesn't mean that no voters are wrong. I highly respect their votes so long as they read the language and decide that only a no vote is warranted. I just fell that our imperfect TA today is still the "least bad" option.
I respect other opinions however. And guess what? If the TA is rejected (which I don't think will happen) the world will still go on and DAL will still make money. I just think our options are slightly brigher over the next three years if the TA passes.
06-28-2012, 12:23 PM
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Mar 2010
Position: SLC 767ER Captain
Posts: 602
The difference is that you can think of the NC as our "buyer's agent" and I can promise you that they didn't take mgmts first or tenth offer. I can assure you that they presented a TA that they felt was the most value they could extract.
The better analogy would be after some torturous negotiating at the dealer you came out with the Passat and your wife was still upset about what you got.
That doesn't mean that no voters are wrong. I highly respect their votes so long as they read the language and decide that only a no vote is warranted. I just fell that our imperfect TA today is still the "least bad" option.
I respect other opinions however. And guess what? If the TA is rejected (which I don't think will happen) the world will still go on and DAL will still make money. I just think our options are slightly brigher over the next three years if the TA passes.
The better analogy would be after some torturous negotiating at the dealer you came out with the Passat and your wife was still upset about what you got.
That doesn't mean that no voters are wrong. I highly respect their votes so long as they read the language and decide that only a no vote is warranted. I just fell that our imperfect TA today is still the "least bad" option.
I respect other opinions however. And guess what? If the TA is rejected (which I don't think will happen) the world will still go on and DAL will still make money. I just think our options are slightly brigher over the next three years if the TA passes.
06-28-2012, 12:27 PM
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Mar 2010
Position: SLC 767ER Captain
Posts: 602
What makes you so arrogant to presume YOU are buying the ovens in the first place? Because management makes a profit and buys a pizza oven so YOU can have a job, doesn't mean YOU bought the oven. P.S. Did you have that arrogant attitude when you went for your DAL interview? Just wondering.
06-28-2012, 12:27 PM
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Oct 2006
Position: Dismayed
Posts: 1,598
The difference is that you can think of the NC as our "buyer's agent" and I can promise you that they didn't take mgmts first or tenth offer. I can assure you that they presented a TA that they felt was the most value they could extract.
The better analogy would be after some torturous negotiating at the dealer you came out with the Passat and your wife was still upset about what you got.
That doesn't mean that no voters are wrong. I highly respect their votes so long as they read the language and decide that only a no vote is warranted. I just fell that our imperfect TA today is still the "least bad" option.
I respect other opinions however. And guess what? If the TA is rejected (which I don't think will happen) the world will still go on and DAL will still make money. I just think our options are slightly brigher over the next three years if the TA passes.
The better analogy would be after some torturous negotiating at the dealer you came out with the Passat and your wife was still upset about what you got.
That doesn't mean that no voters are wrong. I highly respect their votes so long as they read the language and decide that only a no vote is warranted. I just fell that our imperfect TA today is still the "least bad" option.
I respect other opinions however. And guess what? If the TA is rejected (which I don't think will happen) the world will still go on and DAL will still make money. I just think our options are slightly brigher over the next three years if the TA passes.
I guess when the porch falls down and the place gets tented for termites we'll know better next time.
I don't doubt this thing will pass and I will always remember that most on here are keyboard warriors not actual advocates. All of the tough talk from before the year started and when we're offered 4%, we cream our jeans and sell the first born to get the deal. Oh well. C'est la Vie!
06-28-2012, 12:29 PM
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Oct 2006
Position: Dismayed
Posts: 1,598
Waves, I don't get it? Aren't we supposed to think in our jobs? Aren't we supposed to propose better ways of doing things? Are we just supposed to take whatever is shat our way and say thanks?
06-28-2012, 12:43 PM
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Mar 2010
Position: SLC 767ER Captain
Posts: 602
Disagree. if they were truly a buyer agent, they would be telling us what the pitfalls of the agreement and ordering a house inspection. Instead DALPA is singing the praises of this TA to the rafters and there are apparently no flaws.
I guess when the porch falls down and the place gets tented for termites we'll know better next time.
I don't doubt this thing will pass and I will always remember that most on here are keyboard warriors not actual advocates. All of the tough talk from before the year started and when we're offered 4%, we cream our jeans and sell the first born to get the deal. Oh well. C'est la Vie!
I guess when the porch falls down and the place gets tented for termites we'll know better next time.
I don't doubt this thing will pass and I will always remember that most on here are keyboard warriors not actual advocates. All of the tough talk from before the year started and when we're offered 4%, we cream our jeans and sell the first born to get the deal. Oh well. C'est la Vie!
06-28-2012, 12:51 PM
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Mar 2008
Posts: 2,919
I know you are attempting to be coy with your ironic tone, but I'll humor you for a second anyway.
When the union members take a stance to hold the line on scope, we are told that the company must do what it needs to from a fleet planning standpoint to stay viable and remain profitable. Essentially DALPA endorses the use of bigger RJs under lower work rules and compensation as a route to make the company more profitable. We are told that we should look at this from an unemotional standpoint while realizing management cannot, and should not, make aircraft purchases to appease the pilot labor group. We have been drilled by DALPA to accept fleet planning/purchase are BUSINESS decisions plain and simple.
So maybe you can understand why I have a little problem when Sailing comes on here and talks down to us peons about how management is spending 2 billion to purchase B717s for us. It's a business decision, plains and simple, and the order in itself carries very little mileage for me when I look at this TA.
I could careless what aircraft they purchase going forward, as long as most of those aircraft are coming here and being flown by DAL pilots.
When the union members take a stance to hold the line on scope, we are told that the company must do what it needs to from a fleet planning standpoint to stay viable and remain profitable. Essentially DALPA endorses the use of bigger RJs under lower work rules and compensation as a route to make the company more profitable. We are told that we should look at this from an unemotional standpoint while realizing management cannot, and should not, make aircraft purchases to appease the pilot labor group. We have been drilled by DALPA to accept fleet planning/purchase are BUSINESS decisions plain and simple.
So maybe you can understand why I have a little problem when Sailing comes on here and talks down to us peons about how management is spending 2 billion to purchase B717s for us. It's a business decision, plains and simple, and the order in itself carries very little mileage for me when I look at this TA.
I could careless what aircraft they purchase going forward, as long as most of those aircraft are coming here and being flown by DAL pilots.
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