FlyPanAm

What were the top airline jobs in 1986?

beernutt

I didn't either, until it happened. The only thing certain is change.

Having said that, even after 4.2 years of furlough and a 15 year upgrade (full disclosure, could have done 88A NYC in 13 years but eww) I've still had a lot of fun (and still do).

Play the hand you're dealt.

Extenda

You can live a happy upper middle class lifestyle on permanent 2nd year pay. Whether WB B or NB A happens in 5 years or 10 years or that you’re going to have however many years as WB A are all finer points.

the elephant in the room is your income going to zero when they furlough all the way down to your class and no further.

unless a bases decision is extremely important to you I wouldn’t advise anyone to move from any big 3 seniority list for pretty much any other reason.

Nobody knows when the music is going to stop and 1000, 100 or even 1 seniority number junior to you on the list can dramatically change your life way more than whether company A has more ____ than company B.

FyrePilot

About 6 months ago I was faced with same option. I am 39 now.

I took the first class date and I am happy- the company is probably the most solid of the big 3 legacy carriers. They have other ventures like credit card, engine maitenience and fuel refinery- so all the eggs are not in one basket. They seem to be expanding slowly but surely with both WB and NB aircraft. I guess being invested in other international carriers is good for the company, but bad for wide body aspirations of pilots, but I can't do anything about that except invest and push ALPA for more scope on that. The bet on airbus over boeing payed off at least for now.

In general I am treated very well. I am west coast, and I prefer stay away from ATL as much as possible. Like any big base your relative seniority cannot be understated when it comes to QOL- you might want re-think only living in IAH or ATL. Moving for better QOL should always be on the table.

My best guess is 5-10 years to upgrade on NB depending on how picky I am with the base. It might be sooner. If I want to go right seat on WB it will be longer for the 350 and shorter for the 330 or 765. I might make WB captain in my last 3-7 years with no seniority in the seat- I guess I will figure that part out in about 20 years- no sense worrying about it now.

Reserve rules are really good- but like anywhere else- commuting to short call is not fun.

I hope the hiring continues at close to 1k a year so I can get pushed up from the bottom. Given the general health and diet choices of about half of the boomers I sit next to with I think the retirements might be a bit faster as they lose their medicals a lot earlier than 65.


The goal not talked about on these forums enough is to base your lifestyle on year 2-3 NB FO income and not have any ex-wives. If I am not happy at 200-250k annually then I am doing it wrong because that should be way more than enough


United is a good place to be as well I would think. They have lots of orders. Boeing is also sending ZERO 737s out right now. Up to 6 (realistically 4) 787s are coming out of South Carolina a month with a 750 unit backlog. How many and how fast UA gets their order is a wild card. Whether or not they can fill the seats of 250 787s is a wildcard (maybe we will going to london for 99 dollars a seat) Financially I think they are slightly below delta- but I am not an analyst so no opinion is really valid with that. I just know UA is dependent on massive growth.....maybe it happens and maybe it doesn't. Maybe you get a class date and sit around for months or years getting paid min guarantee because they have more pilots than planes. Maybe economy slows and they have more seats available than pax that want to buy them. Or maybe they get 250 WBs and you get left seat in under 10 years and ride it out for the next 20 making a million bucks a year flying 10 days a month to exotic locations with the perfect family and get a giant mansion with a ferrari and a yacht.

Either company you choose- I think you will be fine. You will know if you made the right decision 30 years from now. Or an astroid might hit us tomorrow and it won't matter. Good luck

Viper25

No. They ARE planning to hire over a thousand next year. Unless you heard something more official and more recent than the standards meeting this week.

Full disclaimer that what they plan for and what they actually do due to other unpredictable factors are different things.

Avgeek7248

If you’re hard stuck on the south then it’s hard to beat ATL for us compared to IAH. I lived in the Woodlands. Nice area. United’s prescience in IAH comes and goes but it’s more of a NB hub than an international launch point. There’s something to be said living in HQ. The base will most likely never close. Tons of options for different jobs whether it be on the line or at mothership. Tons of fleet variety. As someone who’s lived in Georgia both north and south of ATL it’s a really nice area and dirt cheap if you don’t mind living in the quieter suburbs outside the crap hope (subjectively) that is the city of ATL. I loved Newman and if you have a family the pilot ghetto of PTC is a great option. You can always keep the CJO in your back pocket if you don’t like it here but if you live in base and don’t mind flying the 717 it’s a great fleet for ATL currently. 737/320 bid packages are pretty terrible for mid to low seniority and with what pops up in OT. 7ER junior is the Florida shuttle. WB has tons of variety once you can hold the right seat in it. Good luck.

170Till5

just rumors. Still have buddies with CJO’s from June waiting on DL class date. Likely JAN or FEB at this rate. Fingers crossed they keep hiring 1,000/year but it’s always good to plan for the worst. No backfills and no fleet to truly replace the 767 or 757 that’s being retired, and the max delays, who knows where hiring will be with Boeing’s issues. Overstaffed on the 220 and 737 from what I’ve heard.

I would imagine Delta makes a 787 order at some point or buys used 787’s from someone eventually 🤞🏼

Devildog40

all very good info thank you! Not too worried about bid packs/flying first couple years.. tho I am seeing IAH captain upgrade on 737/320 is under 2 years, versus 5-ish years for DL? Is that something to weigh highly, seems like a big difference?

Viper25

Of course anything can happen. But there is a plan and that plan represents their intentions if there were no curveballs. Yes, obviously plan for curveballs.

60av8tor

The level of analysis that you're conducting is on one hand admirable and, on the other, a bit over the top. Things change so rapidly that you can't really get as granular as you want. Honestly, trying to nail this jello to the wall is only going to set you up for disappointment. Don't commute, live where you want to live, enjoy life, and watch all the monumental changes over the next gazillion years you have left.