AMS landing incident
07-22-2024, 08:00 AM
#21
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Earplugs or ANC earbuds are good at deadening engine noise. Nothing filters out bumper carts in the 767 aisle and galley. In the 330 bunk, even with earplugs, you can feel the engines spool up for a step climb. Thanks to moving thrust levers, Boeing pilots tend to do better at avoiding throttle bursts in a climb.
07-22-2024, 11:33 PM
#22
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FWIW, there is such a thing as an ANC "Sleep Bud" for side sleepers. I can vouch for the Soundcore A10 by Anker. They now have an A20 out, I believe. I was dubious, but you really can lay your ear on the pillow and not feel them, especially so for a rest-break length nap. Pair them to your phone with any white noise app, and it would take dropping a china plate next to a Class II seat to disturb you.
07-22-2024, 11:49 PM
#23
All is fine at .79
Joined APC: Sep 2016
Position: Paahlot
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Yeah the gusting 40 part sucked and without the gust they would have probably been alright.
Don’t like the situation, go around and ask for the other runway, operational necessity.
They have a convoluted runway decision model over there.
Last edited by TiredSoul; 07-23-2024 at 12:15 AM.
07-23-2024, 05:46 AM
#24
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Anybody else notice in the final report that the relief pilot became PM for landing and the original PM sat in the jumpseat? Is that a thing on some fleets? In all the 3 pilot operations I've ever done the PM comes back from 3rd break and goes back to their control seat with the relief rotating back to the jumpseat.
07-23-2024, 07:36 AM
#25
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Anybody else notice in the final report that the relief pilot became PM for landing and the original PM sat in the jumpseat? Is that a thing on some fleets? In all the 3 pilot operations I've ever done the PM comes back from 3rd break and goes back to their control seat with the relief rotating back to the jumpseat.
07-23-2024, 08:03 AM
#26
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Anybody else notice in the final report that the relief pilot became PM for landing and the original PM sat in the jumpseat? Is that a thing on some fleets? In all the 3 pilot operations I've ever done the PM comes back from 3rd break and goes back to their control seat with the relief rotating back to the jumpseat.
There are FAR 117 guidelines for 3 pilot rest breaks. The landing pilot gets at least 120 consecutive minutes in the last half of the FDP. PM requires 90 minutes, but not specified when. It would make sense that 3rd break is better rested than 1st break upon landing in most circumstances.
07-23-2024, 09:10 AM
#27
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Anybody else notice in the final report that the relief pilot became PM for landing and the original PM sat in the jumpseat? Is that a thing on some fleets? In all the 3 pilot operations I've ever done the PM comes back from 3rd break and goes back to their control seat with the relief rotating back to the jumpseat.
07-23-2024, 10:05 AM
#28
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Anybody else notice in the final report that the relief pilot became PM for landing and the original PM sat in the jumpseat? Is that a thing on some fleets? In all the 3 pilot operations I've ever done the PM comes back from 3rd break and goes back to their control seat with the relief rotating back to the jumpseat.
If I’m ever WBA some day, I don’t plan to support this rest plan. A monitoring FO who has been on the flight deck for two continuous rest breaks after what is often an ineffective first break can be nearly useless.
07-23-2024, 07:14 PM
#29
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The bigger issue in this case was the fact that nobody called for a go around. Two dots low? Keep it coming. Big sinker on short final. Easy with it. Not to mention that sometimes Autothrust isn’t your friend.
07-24-2024, 03:49 AM
#30
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I dare say if the jumpseat was the best place to put your most rested crewmember we’d probably normalize that and incorporate into FARs. Alas, the PF and PM are the spots we have actual rest requirements defined.
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