C44 Recall
06-13-2024, 02:57 PM
#341
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Oct 2017
Position: 737 A
Posts: 1,032
I looked and didn’t find any vote totals posted anywhere. You might be correct, or it might have been a unilateral DH call for all I know.
As someone that is/was part of the group RR dispute. This strikes me as a horrible solution to the problem. I thought we could wait for an arbitrator’s decision not write it into compliance.
As someone that is/was part of the group RR dispute. This strikes me as a horrible solution to the problem. I thought we could wait for an arbitrator’s decision not write it into compliance.
Last edited by Vsop; 06-13-2024 at 03:22 PM.
06-13-2024, 03:36 PM
#342
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Jan 2008
Posts: 1,341
I looked and didn’t find any vote totals posted anywhere. You might be correct, or it might have been a unilateral DH call for all I know.
As someone that is/was part of the group RR dispute. This strikes me as a horrible solution to the problem. I thought we could wait for an arbitrator’s decision not write it into compliance.
As someone that is/was part of the group RR dispute. This strikes me as a horrible solution to the problem. I thought we could wait for an arbitrator’s decision not write it into compliance.
06-13-2024, 03:36 PM
#343
Moderator
Joined APC: Dec 2007
Position: DAL 330
Posts: 6,991
Yes, and that was previously called an illegal reroute prior to departure of the first leg. The penalty for that required removing the entire rotation from the pilot’s schedule, with pay, or paying assignment pay (TRIPLE pay for the entire rotation).
This MEC once again further devalued our PWA and cost us negotiating capital. They’ve become a complete liability, necessitating prompt removal from office.
This MEC once again further devalued our PWA and cost us negotiating capital. They’ve become a complete liability, necessitating prompt removal from office.
It was a while ago and I am going from memory so correct me if this is not correct, but this happened to me and from my calling DALPA and asking around I was told that yes it could be an illegal reroute. However the company could just cancel the flight which triggers an IROP, NOOP or some other OP.
This then means that you have a recovery obligation if you wanted to get paid and they could turn around and give you the same trip.Something about the flight being canceled is a NOOP which kicks in the recovery obligation. This deal seems fine to me and IMHO is not something worth grabbing the torches and pitchforks.
Scoop
06-13-2024, 04:49 PM
#344
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Oct 2017
Position: 737 A
Posts: 1,032
I agree with scoop that this isn’t a “burn it down” agreement by itself, but I don’t like the ongoing pattern of: negotiate rule, company changes rules, agree to rewrite rules in company’s favor.
06-13-2024, 05:20 PM
#345
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Feb 2020
Posts: 427
It was a while ago and I am going from memory so correct me if this is not correct, but this happened to me and from my calling DALPA and asking around I was told that yes it could be an illegal reroute. However the company could just cancel the flight which triggers an IROP, NOOP or some other OP. This then means that you have a recovery obligation if you wanted to get paid and they could turn around and give you the same trip.
Something about the flight being canceled is a NOOP which kicks in the recovery obligation. This deal seems fine to me and IMHO is not something worth grabbing the torches and pitchforks.
Scoop
This then means that you have a recovery obligation if you wanted to get paid and they could turn around and give you the same trip.Something about the flight being canceled is a NOOP which kicks in the recovery obligation. This deal seems fine to me and IMHO is not something worth grabbing the torches and pitchforks.
Scoop
Before if a pilot who was DHing then changed to operate the same flight, the company said too bad, so sad. Not extra pay.
Now the existing RR rules kick in for this scenario and vice versa.
06-13-2024, 06:12 PM
#346
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Jul 2022
Posts: 930
It was a while ago and I am going from memory so correct me if this is not correct, but this happened to me and from my calling DALPA and asking around I was told that yes it could be an illegal reroute. However the company could just cancel the flight which triggers an IROP, NOOP or some other OP. This then means that you have a recovery obligation if you wanted to get paid and they could turn around and give you the same trip.
This then means that you have a recovery obligation if you wanted to get paid and they could turn around and give you the same trip.Even then, that type of intentional circumvention would likely be viewed accordingly by an arbitrator.
06-13-2024, 06:19 PM
#347
Can’t find crew pickup
Joined APC: Jun 2021
Posts: 2,235
To date, I’m not aware of any situation in which the company purposely cancelled and re-built a flight solely to circumvent our PWA. It’s easier said than done. The cancellation process automatically notifies passengers, triggers automated rebookings, enables refunds and OAL rebookings, and negatively impacts Delta’s metrics.
Even then, that type of intentional circumvention would likely be viewed accordingly by an arbitrator.
Not true. The company has previously agreed with ALPA that this situation constitutes an illegal reroute. I personally received assignment pay for it several years ago. Their new policy of refusing to pay these is another “press to test” against this MEC. Management bet that the MEC would fold prior to arbitration, and they were correct.
Even then, that type of intentional circumvention would likely be viewed accordingly by an arbitrator.
Not true. The company has previously agreed with ALPA that this situation constitutes an illegal reroute. I personally received assignment pay for it several years ago. Their new policy of refusing to pay these is another “press to test” against this MEC. Management bet that the MEC would fold prior to arbitration, and they were correct.
One of my big things is tightening IROP definitions on this next contract too. Along with reserve guarantee.
06-13-2024, 06:22 PM
#348
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Feb 2020
Posts: 427
Not true. The company has previously agreed with ALPA that this situation constitutes an illegal reroute. I personally received assignment pay for it several years ago. Their new policy of refusing to pay these is another “press to test” against this MEC. Management bet that the MEC would fold prior to arbitration, and they were correct.
Again, it’s not refusing to pay, it’s kicking RR pay.
06-13-2024, 06:30 PM
#349
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Jul 2022
Posts: 930
RR pay is a tiny fraction of assignment pay for the entire trip. Pilots are losing thousands per occurrence over what they are owed per the PWA, and this MEC is fine with that.
06-13-2024, 06:48 PM
#350
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Apr 2018
Posts: 3,238
Only recently. Not paying assignment pay for this situation is NOT the company’s historic stance.
RR pay is a tiny fraction of assignment pay for the entire trip. Pilots are losing thousands per occurrence over what they are owed per the PWA, and this MEC is fine with that.
RR pay is a tiny fraction of assignment pay for the entire trip. Pilots are losing thousands per occurrence over what they are owed per the PWA, and this MEC is fine with that.
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