Originally Posted by FL370esq

This discussion has me dizzy. 😁 Seems like two things are getting mixed up or not well explained. At the top of the AE results is posted the latest conversion date - March 2nd, 2024 for the most recent AE award. If you have been awarded an AE but have not been converted to your awarded category by that date (March 2, 2024 or...the March bid period, in this example) you are automatically converted to your awarded category and you are no longer permitted to fly in your current category (22.D.6 and 22.E.7). You just collect your new pay at a pro-rated portion of the ALV for each day you are awaiting training (11.b.1.e). and wait for them to train you. That is the guiding rule and there are a few exceptions; (1) you and the company could mutually agree to extend your conversion window so that you can continue to fly in your current category while you await training and thus have no pay protection for your new rate; and (2) you have an AE to a Captain position but do not meet the FAR minimums (less the required OE time) and won't meet them by the end of the conversion window. In that case, you would remain in your current category until you get that FAR time (less required OE time) and you will not be pay protected at your new rate.

The more common "conversion" is found in 22.E.6 and that states that your conversion to your new category is based on your completion date of training (sim, not OE). If on or before the 16th of the month, you convert on the first day of the bid period for that month. If after the 16th, you convert the following bid period. That can be interesting if you finish your 44X on the 17th, go out on your OE rotation on the 21st and finish your required OE hours and landings on the 24th. Guess what? You can't pick up that sweet 5 day GS in your new category that went to a pilot 1,000 numbers junior to you because you really aren't in the category after you complete OE until the start of the next bid period. You simply have the rest of the month off with no more pay.

Clear as mud?

Originally Posted by S4User

I'm talking about the monthly AEs. With the current monthly AEs, there is a clear conversion date (1st of xx month). If you are, for example, upgrading from FO to CA and training starts, say, on the 15th of the month prior to conversion, you are paid that month at FO rate. Once the 1st rolls around and if still in training (depending on footprint, short/long course), then the remaining training dates is paid at CA rate for your new category since conversion set by the AE has expired.

Now, if you do something different and talk to management/training about it, then that's a unique exception/situation and not the rule.

Originally Posted by FL370esq

First off, that conversion date on the awards is mere a projected conversion date and has no binding on anything. The date at the top (March 2, 2024 is the binding and controlling latest date). The dates you see on each awardee's line is a projected conversion based on projected training. Until your training is actually assigned, it means nothing. Once your training is assigned, look at the date of your 44X. 22.E.6 tells us that if it is on or before the 16th, you convert to your new category (and, therefore, your new category pay rate) that month. If it is after the 16th, you convert to your new category (and, therefore, your new category pay rate) the following month. It doesn't matter if you are going from ATL717B to ATL320A, ATL717B to ATL330B, or ATL320A to ATL350B. The conversion rule is all the same. Once you convert, you get the new category pay. And, if you are the ATL320A to ATL350B pilot, your new pay rate will be less.
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Originally Posted by FL370esq

You are probably right but, I think, structurally that is incorrect because you have voluntarily and mutually agreed to extend your latest conversion date so, by extending, you haven't hit the end of your conversion window. However, in reality, you should get the new category pay rate because of the pay protection afforded you when a junior pilot to you, from the same AE and awarded the same category (who also requires training like you), converts before you do.

Originally Posted by S4User

We're looking at two different things. That conversion date has the new AE window based on the signed PWA. You get new category pay on the 1st, regardless of when you started training (before or after said date). Not sure what's so confusing. That's the whole point of these monthly AEs...to shorten the conversion windows signed in the PWA and make it more predictable (conversion on 1st) and now have these windows that go 210-365 days later.

Hagn!

Originally Posted by Whoopsmybad

They did this a lot coming out of COVID in short categories, and there were more than a few still flying as a FO making CA pay.

Originally Posted by FL370esq

You can't beat that with a stick. Had to be the company enticing the pilot to agree to an extension and who wouldn't?? 🤣 Show me the money!!!

Originally Posted by FL370esq

​​​​Are you saying, for example, the company pushes your training out for the current award from a January protection to a new actual start date of February 28th but a finish date of, let's say, March 20th?

Originally Posted by S4User

No, I'm talking about training that overlaps the conversion date...which with these monthly AEs, all occur on the 1st of the month.

Originally Posted by DWC CAP10 USAF

First day of bid period, not month.

31 Jan is the first day of the Feb period.