Prepare yourselves… 2023 AEs
10-21-2023, 09:54 PM
#5541
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Oct 2023
Posts: 161
Locals can choose to commute for better seniority or QOL. Locals can move to be closer to their family without risking significant QOL reduction. Might even be fewer divorced pilots that way. Then we wouldn't have to fight about retirement.
I disagree that it's changing the rules. It's the continued acknowledgement that not everyone should have to live within an hour or two of Delta hubs otherwise get punished for 20 years.
I disagree that it's changing the rules. It's the continued acknowledgement that not everyone should have to live within an hour or two of Delta hubs otherwise get punished for 20 years.
That has only started to remotely change in the last couple of years, and that's why you see some people really wrapped up about it. They feel like they're losing their grip on the system. I was talking to one guy in the crew lounge, and he was furious about the change to GS going out 2 days out. I said there seem to be lots to go around, so why the upset, but he wouldn't even stop to consider that, and it was all about maximizing his deal.
One thing that has changed for the better, is now people are open about how to work the system. When I started, some of the tricks were kept to a very tight circle, and you had to be "in" to get the knowledge.
10-22-2023, 06:21 AM
#5542
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Nov 2020
Posts: 1,901
I think the argument is this
pilot 1. Buys a way smaller house close to NYC for way more than he should solely for the benefit of living close to the junior base and being able to accrue seniority faster than living where he really wants to.
pilot 2. Buys a giant house in anytown USA knowing he is going to have to play the jumpseat game to get to work, but he is happy because he has a lower cost of living and gets to live where he wants.
introduce PSC. Pilot 2 upgrades early, switches bases, commutes to a junior base from a senior base etc. essentially enjoying the trappings of living in a low cost of living area knowing the company will just buy him a ticket to go to work.
Expanded scenario: senior ATL ER who lives in atlanta decides to switch to NYC ER. The flying is way way better. If they’re just going to buy them a ticket to go to work why wouldn’t you bid it? The 3 day trip footprints will be the same and you’re guaranteed a flight to work that shows an hour before departure then you get a positive space seat an hour after you land when the trip is over. NYC ER pilot pushed down the seniority list because ATL ER pilot bids all the Gucci europe trips then goes home to his peachtree city mansion twice the size and half the price of NYC ERs Long Island split level.
both pilots got hired knowing the rules of the game and the stakes on choosing their base and where to settle down. Now “commuters” are lobbying to change the rules which would solely benefit them at the expense of the local.
I’m ambivalent like you but this is the anti-
psc argument don’t flame me lol.
pilot 1. Buys a way smaller house close to NYC for way more than he should solely for the benefit of living close to the junior base and being able to accrue seniority faster than living where he really wants to.
pilot 2. Buys a giant house in anytown USA knowing he is going to have to play the jumpseat game to get to work, but he is happy because he has a lower cost of living and gets to live where he wants.
introduce PSC. Pilot 2 upgrades early, switches bases, commutes to a junior base from a senior base etc. essentially enjoying the trappings of living in a low cost of living area knowing the company will just buy him a ticket to go to work.
Expanded scenario: senior ATL ER who lives in atlanta decides to switch to NYC ER. The flying is way way better. If they’re just going to buy them a ticket to go to work why wouldn’t you bid it? The 3 day trip footprints will be the same and you’re guaranteed a flight to work that shows an hour before departure then you get a positive space seat an hour after you land when the trip is over. NYC ER pilot pushed down the seniority list because ATL ER pilot bids all the Gucci europe trips then goes home to his peachtree city mansion twice the size and half the price of NYC ERs Long Island split level.
both pilots got hired knowing the rules of the game and the stakes on choosing their base and where to settle down. Now “commuters” are lobbying to change the rules which would solely benefit them at the expense of the local.
I’m ambivalent like you but this is the anti-
psc argument don’t flame me lol.
I attribute this to gangbusters hiring during the post COVID PSC time and many new hires who might have bit the bullet and moved to base instead just got used to the idea of commuting from FL forever.
Even though I personally enjoyed it, that is the one reason I personally thought that PSC would never fly for the company long term as with the rate of minting new commuters and planned future hiring, the company could see how 10% of all our seats out of certain FL stations were nothing but PSC employees consistently.
10-22-2023, 06:43 AM
#5543
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Aug 2020
Posts: 670
I stopped reading this and all your posts after this statement. Oct 2023 join date? Been here 30 years? 21 posts so far this month. So basically, you want us to believe you quietly lurked here all these years, now "suddenly" you have lots to say?
No, it's one of these options:
1. Long time APC-er who got his account banned so you opened a new one
2. New troll account (CBreezyOOfff is that you?)
3. You're Lying
4. All of the above
Either way, you have zero credibility with your "been here over 30 years". Nice round number. Sure you have.
No, it's one of these options:
1. Long time APC-er who got his account banned so you opened a new one
2. New troll account (CBreezyOOfff is that you?)
3. You're Lying
4. All of the above
Either way, you have zero credibility with your "been here over 30 years". Nice round number. Sure you have.
10-22-2023, 07:05 AM
#5544
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Jul 2013
Posts: 10,535
I stopped reading this and all your posts after this statement. Oct 2023 join date? Been here 30 years? 21 posts so far this month. So basically, you want us to believe you quietly lurked here all these years, now "suddenly" you have lots to say?
No, it's one of these options:
1. Long time APC-er who got his account banned so you opened a new one
2. New troll account (CBreezyOOfff is that you?)
3. You're Lying
4. All of the above
Either way, you have zero credibility with your "been here over 30 years". Nice round number. Sure you have.
No, it's one of these options:
1. Long time APC-er who got his account banned so you opened a new one
2. New troll account (CBreezyOOfff is that you?)
3. You're Lying
4. All of the above
Either way, you have zero credibility with your "been here over 30 years". Nice round number. Sure you have.
10-22-2023, 08:33 AM
#5548
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Dec 2012
Position: Supreme Allied Commander
Posts: 1,074
I think the argument is this
pilot 1. Buys a way smaller house close to NYC for way more than he should solely for the benefit of living close to the junior base and being able to accrue seniority faster than living where he really wants to.
pilot 2. Buys a giant house in anytown USA knowing he is going to have to play the jumpseat game to get to work, but he is happy because he has a lower cost of living and gets to live where he wants.
introduce PSC. Pilot 2 upgrades early, switches bases, commutes to a junior base from a senior base etc. essentially enjoying the trappings of living in a low cost of living area knowing the company will just buy him a ticket to go to work.
Expanded scenario: senior ATL ER who lives in atlanta decides to switch to NYC ER. The flying is way way better. If they’re just going to buy them a ticket to go to work why wouldn’t you bid it? The 3 day trip footprints will be the same and you’re guaranteed a flight to work that shows an hour before departure then you get a positive space seat an hour after you land when the trip is over. NYC ER pilot pushed down the seniority list because ATL ER pilot bids all the Gucci europe trips then goes home to his peachtree city mansion twice the size and half the price of NYC ERs Long Island split level.
both pilots got hired knowing the rules of the game and the stakes on choosing their base and where to settle down. Now “commuters” are lobbying to change the rules which would solely benefit them at the expense of the local.
I’m ambivalent like you but this is the anti-
psc argument don’t flame me lol.
pilot 1. Buys a way smaller house close to NYC for way more than he should solely for the benefit of living close to the junior base and being able to accrue seniority faster than living where he really wants to.
pilot 2. Buys a giant house in anytown USA knowing he is going to have to play the jumpseat game to get to work, but he is happy because he has a lower cost of living and gets to live where he wants.
introduce PSC. Pilot 2 upgrades early, switches bases, commutes to a junior base from a senior base etc. essentially enjoying the trappings of living in a low cost of living area knowing the company will just buy him a ticket to go to work.
Expanded scenario: senior ATL ER who lives in atlanta decides to switch to NYC ER. The flying is way way better. If they’re just going to buy them a ticket to go to work why wouldn’t you bid it? The 3 day trip footprints will be the same and you’re guaranteed a flight to work that shows an hour before departure then you get a positive space seat an hour after you land when the trip is over. NYC ER pilot pushed down the seniority list because ATL ER pilot bids all the Gucci europe trips then goes home to his peachtree city mansion twice the size and half the price of NYC ERs Long Island split level.
both pilots got hired knowing the rules of the game and the stakes on choosing their base and where to settle down. Now “commuters” are lobbying to change the rules which would solely benefit them at the expense of the local.
I’m ambivalent like you but this is the anti-
psc argument don’t flame me lol.
Let's be real. In your example it'd still be preferable to most folks who live in PTC to drive to work than PSC to NYC. Maybe the one offs on WBs or ER at specific seniorities. Commuting, even PSC, still eats up more of your time off, limits your report & release times, etc.
10-22-2023, 08:47 AM
#5549
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Jul 2022
Posts: 947
How is this a bad thing for ATL pilots? If some pilots senior to them choose to commute to another base to better attain seniority, wouldn't that be a good thing, and make the ATL good deals more attainable?
Let's be real. In your example it'd still be preferable to most folks who live in PTC to drive to work than PSC to NYC. Maybe the one offs on WBs or ER at specific seniorities. Commuting, even PSC, still eats up more of your time off, limits your report & release times, etc.
Let's be real. In your example it'd still be preferable to most folks who live in PTC to drive to work than PSC to NYC. Maybe the one offs on WBs or ER at specific seniorities. Commuting, even PSC, still eats up more of your time off, limits your report & release times, etc.
Commuting will never go away in this industry. Many airlines have found ways to make it less stressful, without uproar from the locals. It’s time to move past the old “commuting is a choice” mindset here. Even the old guard should know better as they’ve seen a plethora of bases close.
10-22-2023, 08:56 AM
#5550
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Aug 2020
Posts: 670
This attitude is the same thing that killed virtual bases, which would have solved a lot of our problems. Now the FAs are getting what we could have had years ago.
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