PilotBases

The 2021-24 hiring is incredible when you think about it. 3 calendar years could be 8-10 retirement years difference. The first post Covid class is closer to Widebody A than they are to a current newhire. Or at least equidistant.

ancman

The problem with our system is that it encourages behavior that makes non-rev travel planning even more difficult than it already is.

Regardless of how senior anyone here is, there will always be the family of 6 with a 1981 DOH that decides to list and check in an hour before departure, throwing everyone else for a loop.

Our system promotes that behavior, both by totally disregarding time of check-in and even disincentivizing early check-in with the S2 game. Many senior employees / families intentionally list last minute to avoid those junior to them burning S2’s, which in turn results in them doing the same.

Having worked under both AA’s system (in a past life) and ours, I would take AA’s time of check-in system any day. I have yet to meet an AA employee (even among the most senior) who prefers our system. Predictability and planning is far better under AA’s system, even for the senior.

crewdawg

Or just have a min time to list for S2 (say 24 hours) and/or once you've listed S3, you can't convert to S2 on the same flight. Force peple to telegraph their plans and make their decesion early. Last time I non-revved everyone got into this silly game of S2 swaps. I just list S2 from the get go because I don't ever burn through my six. Revenue tickets on FCFL is a much less stressful way to travel.

sailingfun

35 plus years of non reving I never had a large family jump ahead of me at the last minute. I know it happens but not often. What seemed to happen more often was their were not enough seats for a large family so I got on as they would decline to split up.
I did now and then see someone switching to a S2 at the last minute. I had non rev privileges on AA. I disliked the system forcing me to get up at 3AM to checkin. What I really hated about that system was going to the bottom of the list for subsequent flights if I did not get on the planned flight or it was delayed or canceled.
One thing I really like about United system is the ability when checking loads to also get a quote for a positive space ticket simultaneously. Their prices for PS seem to be about half what Delta charges in general. If you commute on UAL and purchase positive space it also eliminates the back up flight requirement.

GogglesPisano

I didn't think we were allowed to switch priorities after check-in. Has something changed? Or are rogue gate agents doing this?

ancman

That’s not how AA’s system works at all. If you roll over to a subsequent flight, you keep your original time of check in. That typically places you ahead of non-revs on the subsequent flight, assuming you checked in 24 hours prior.

Waking up at 3 AM to check in isn’t really a thing either, as check in opens 24 hours prior. How many flights depart at 3 AM? (Edit: I’m guessing you’re referring to AA’s former 4 hour prior check in for non-revs, which has been gone for more than a decade).

Having seen UA’s PS prices and options, I do agree with you there.

ancman

Cancelling your listing, making a new listing, and checking in at a different priority is permitted. I see it often.

Apejackson

I’ll jump on this and say this was one reason I liked AAs nonrev better. If you get bumped from a flight, you’re automatically rolled to the next flight and you keep your original check-in time putting you at the top of the list. Also, the predictability was really nice with the check-in priority.

I’ve come to terms with the seniority of the pilot list. I got into flying late in the game so I know I’ll never be super senior but that doesn’t bother me. Even with low seniority, I’ve been afforded better QOL and choices than I imagined I would be able to achieve. The problem with the seniority for nonrev is like others have stated. We are limited in the amount of seniority we can accrue. Other employee groups are not. There’s no way I could ever compete with the FAs that refuse to retire. I had this happen a couple weeks ago: D1 and Premium Select were wide open 24 hours prior. My wife and I listed with S2s and were looking like D1. 12 hours prior more people listed but still looked good. 6 hours prior the piling on started. By the time the flight left we had been bumped 20 spots back to coach. We made the flight so it all worked out but was just frustrating watching how quickly things fell apart. This is not a unique experience when my family has nonrevved. It seems the piling on starts to happen within 4-6 hours of departure sometimes forcing us to purchase last-minute tickets or change plans completely.

With a wife that works and kids in school, I need something much more concrete when traveling. We normally purchase tickets but our FCFL program sucks. As employees we should get something more aligned to “cost+%” for the tickets. Instead, they’re tied directly to the listed price. Often times a FCFL ticket purchased 2 weeks out is more expensive than a regularly purchased ticket 4 months out. I work for Delta and love that we turn a great profit and that we negotiated a piece of that, but please don’t build that profit by taking it out of your employees pockets.

CBreezy

​​​​​​
You can ask the gate agent to do it for you as long as you're before the cutoff

RAH RAH REE

Anybody know why if I set a Award Trips with Pairing report time < 2000 it gave me trips 2 trips that start at 2100? There were junior pilots with given trips that fit my schedule bids. Reasons report just shows that line honored.


Current Bid >>
-------------------------
1. Pairing Bid Group
2. Set Condition Minimum Credit Window
Honored
3. Prefer Off Weekends
Honored
4. Award Pairings If Any Layover In CDG, MAD, MUC, MXP
Awarded to senior bidder: 128
Violates bid number 3: 6
(0 Awarded, 134 Matching, Running total: 000:00)
5. Award Pairings If Any Layover In LHR And Starting At < 20:00
A662 2024-11-06 21:00 2024-11-08 21:30 (018:00) (B)
A629 2024-11-12 21:00 2024-11-14 21:30 (018:00) (B)
A624 2024-11-20 19:55 2024-11-22 19:50 (018:00) (B)
A614 2024-11-27 17:15 2024-11-29 17:55 (018:05) (B)
Schedule is complete: 168
(4 Awarded, 172 Matching, Running total: 072:05)
6. Award Pairings If Pairing Check-In Time > 10:00
If Pairing Check-Out Time < 21:00
If Pairing Length > 1 days
Award Pairings


Here is one trip given to a junior pilot:

A657 2024-11-05 19:55 2024-11-07 19:50 (018:00) (B)