Any "Latest & Greatest about Delta?" Part 2
12-17-2023, 02:48 PM
#3781
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: May 2012
Posts: 364
My senority bracket was stuck as FOs during 60-65, unlike you who could hold captain. Now we could be held back from WB A, think 2000-2001 hires. So it is not blatant bull*******t as you say, it is real.
In the end I dont really GAS, but to say it would harm no one is disingenous at best
12-17-2023, 03:55 PM
#3782
Moderator
Joined APC: Dec 2007
Position: DAL 330
Posts: 6,991
As a late 99 north hire I would disagree. I can finally as of the last bids hold WB A ( Sorry the 7ER is a WB in name not pay, the 321 NEO pays the same) So yes, not having retirements for 2 years will definately hurt my progression.
My senority bracket was stuck as FOs during 60-65, unlike you who could hold captain. Now we could be held back from WB A, think 2000-2001 hires. So it is not blatant bull*******t as you say, it is real.
In the end I dont really GAS, but to say it would harm no one is disingenous at best
My senority bracket was stuck as FOs during 60-65, unlike you who could hold captain. Now we could be held back from WB A, think 2000-2001 hires. So it is not blatant bull*******t as you say, it is real.
In the end I dont really GAS, but to say it would harm no one is disingenous at best
You hit the nail squarely on the head. All this talk that there would be no stagnation because we have 2 year ER Captains is a straw man.
The sub 10k Pilots would be adversely affected but minimally. The 1999-2001 hires would see very negative affects of age 67.
Many in this group were furloughed, spent 5 extra years yanking gear and now within sight of good WB A movement are looking at 2 years of minimal movement.
I have never seen a pro 67 advocate comment on how it would affect this group. That said I don’t feel strongly one way or another but if I was King for a day I would not support age 67.
Yes many senior Pilots were crushed in BK and the subsequent lost decade and I don’t blame them for advocating for 67 but something you don’t often hear is when we, DALPA , passed LOA 51, agreeing to not fight the pension termination 100% of DAL Pilots had a pension. 100%!!!! And we rolled over like a French army fighting the Germans.
To blame junior Pilots for not fighting a fight we ourselves acquiesced on is not right. With that said I see guys both junior and senior flaming the other demographic on this issue.
Scoop - just my 2 cents
12-17-2023, 03:58 PM
#3783
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: May 2015
Position: A350 Both
Posts: 7,292
12-17-2023, 04:01 PM
#3784
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: May 2015
Position: A350 Both
Posts: 7,292
That's true. In fairness, 67 will have much less of an effect than what 60-65 did. Whether the economy plays a similar or lesser enhancing role remains to be seen. And don't pretend like that's not a possibility...
He didn't gaslight at all. CBreezy makes a fair point. There are a TON more pilots who were harmed much worse, with much less time to "make it up" (aka restoration) than the current 63-64 year olds. Using the argument "for" 67, that it's somehow making up for a stolen pension is lazy, and ignores the many pilots who were much deeper in the "DZ" than anyone here today. That's what drives many of the "against" crowd nuts. The ones who act like they are entitled to it, when there are (retired) pilots hurt worse who get/got nothing. "Too bad, so sad"
Look, I understand most of those who are "for" 67, and don't blame them one bit for hoping it passes. Frankly, if I were 64 I'd probably be for it too. But just be honest about the why. "Restoration" is an uncompelling, weak, and off-putting argument. "I feel good, want to work, and it's out of our hands anyway" is much more understandable, and won't get y'all nearly the blowback. You might even get a few converts. And obtw, "you just want me out of your seat" makes a good bumper sticker, but it is lazy too. There are lots of legitimate arguments "against".
Bottom line, you can't expect anyone to be sympathetic to your plight when you ignore and/or belittle theirs.
He didn't gaslight at all. CBreezy makes a fair point. There are a TON more pilots who were harmed much worse, with much less time to "make it up" (aka restoration) than the current 63-64 year olds. Using the argument "for" 67, that it's somehow making up for a stolen pension is lazy, and ignores the many pilots who were much deeper in the "DZ" than anyone here today. That's what drives many of the "against" crowd nuts. The ones who act like they are entitled to it, when there are (retired) pilots hurt worse who get/got nothing. "Too bad, so sad"
Look, I understand most of those who are "for" 67, and don't blame them one bit for hoping it passes. Frankly, if I were 64 I'd probably be for it too. But just be honest about the why. "Restoration" is an uncompelling, weak, and off-putting argument. "I feel good, want to work, and it's out of our hands anyway" is much more understandable, and won't get y'all nearly the blowback. You might even get a few converts. And obtw, "you just want me out of your seat" makes a good bumper sticker, but it is lazy too. There are lots of legitimate arguments "against".
Bottom line, you can't expect anyone to be sympathetic to your plight when you ignore and/or belittle theirs.
I love my job. I know a lot of guys on here don't, and that's fine. But because you don't and want to leave doesn't mean I have no life. And since we have firmly established that you don't owe me anything and I don't owe you anything, if it passes I will stay as long as I am medically able or until I get tired of it whichever occurs first.
I am about to discover the finest ramen shop in all of Tokyo before the year is out. Life is pretty damned good.
12-17-2023, 04:11 PM
#3785
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Apr 2007
Posts: 4,614
12-17-2023, 04:18 PM
#3786
Moderator
Joined APC: Dec 2007
Position: DAL 330
Posts: 6,991
OK then how about this:
I love my job. I know a lot of guys on here don't, and that's fine. But because you don't and want to leave doesn't mean I have no life. And since we have firmly established that you don't owe me anything and I don't owe you anything, if it passes I will stay as long as I am medically able or until I get tired of it whichever occurs first.
I am about to discover the finest ramen shop in all of Tokyo before the year is out. Life is pretty damned good.
I love my job. I know a lot of guys on here don't, and that's fine. But because you don't and want to leave doesn't mean I have no life. And since we have firmly established that you don't owe me anything and I don't owe you anything, if it passes I will stay as long as I am medically able or until I get tired of it whichever occurs first.
I am about to discover the finest ramen shop in all of Tokyo before the year is out. Life is pretty damned good.
Damm - just missed you. Left HND yesterday. Have a great layover!
Scoop
12-17-2023, 04:33 PM
#3787
Moderator
Joined APC: Sep 2011
Posts: 4,811
OK then how about this:
I love my job. I know a lot of guys on here don't, and that's fine. But because you don't and want to leave doesn't mean I have no life. And since we have firmly established that you don't owe me anything and I don't owe you anything, if it passes I will stay as long as I am medically able or until I get tired of it whichever occurs first.
I am about to discover the finest ramen shop in all of Tokyo before the year is out. Life is pretty damned good.
I love my job. I know a lot of guys on here don't, and that's fine. But because you don't and want to leave doesn't mean I have no life. And since we have firmly established that you don't owe me anything and I don't owe you anything, if it passes I will stay as long as I am medically able or until I get tired of it whichever occurs first.
I am about to discover the finest ramen shop in all of Tokyo before the year is out. Life is pretty damned good.
Have a nice layover!
12-17-2023, 05:02 PM
#3788
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Apr 2018
Posts: 3,237
As a late 99 north hire I would disagree. I can finally as of the last bids hold WB A ( Sorry the 7ER is a WB in name not pay, the 321 NEO pays the same) So yes, not having retirements for 2 years will definately hurt my progression.
My senority bracket was stuck as FOs during 60-65, unlike you who could hold captain. Now we could be held back from WB A, think 2000-2001 hires. So it is not blatant bull*******t as you say, it is real.
In the end I dont really GAS, but to say it would harm no one is disingenous at best
My senority bracket was stuck as FOs during 60-65, unlike you who could hold captain. Now we could be held back from WB A, think 2000-2001 hires. So it is not blatant bull*******t as you say, it is real.
In the end I dont really GAS, but to say it would harm no one is disingenous at best
12-18-2023, 04:23 AM
#3789
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Aug 2020
Posts: 670
12-18-2023, 05:11 AM
#3790
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Jan 2020
Posts: 379
go ahead, we’ll wait.
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