Any "Latest & Greatest about Delta?" Part 2
09-11-2023, 04:49 PM
#2861
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Jul 2022
Posts: 929
I would’ve preferred to see a requirement that trips be run through one PCS run codified in the PWA.
09-12-2023, 07:11 AM
#2862
Can’t find crew pickup
Joined APC: Jun 2021
Posts: 2,231
I’m sure we are on the same page here but:
for clarity. You may begin an FDP that could potentially show more than 138 hours of duty since your last 30 hour break as long as that FDP *began* prior to the 138 hour limit that would necessitate a new 30 hour break (138+30=168, 30 of that being the rest) prior to a new FDP
Assume you’ve had 30 hours off and you begin at 1200E today (9/11). You can operate FDPs that begin as late as 0559E/17th (+137 hours 59 minutes) within an intervening 30 hour break. That final FDP beginning at 0559E may intrude into where you might expect the 30 hours to begin. However I once that FDP ends you now need a prospective 30 hours prior to any new FDPs.
for clarity. You may begin an FDP that could potentially show more than 138 hours of duty since your last 30 hour break as long as that FDP *began* prior to the 138 hour limit that would necessitate a new 30 hour break (138+30=168, 30 of that being the rest) prior to a new FDP
Assume you’ve had 30 hours off and you begin at 1200E today (9/11). You can operate FDPs that begin as late as 0559E/17th (+137 hours 59 minutes) within an intervening 30 hour break. That final FDP beginning at 0559E may intrude into where you might expect the 30 hours to begin. However I once that FDP ends you now need a prospective 30 hours prior to any new FDPs.
My question for clarification is that starts hour 169, because you are considered in rest up until 2359 your last off day, correct?
Also for the first day if you are on shirt call at some point it still starts at midnight day one, you just convert to a different on call status?
Dont bid reserve often, haven’t in a long time, but considering trying to see how the new rules suit me.
09-12-2023, 07:25 AM
#2863
Roll’n Thunder
Joined APC: Oct 2009
Position: Pilot
Posts: 3,835
Just as a question/clarification, if you have more than a 6 day block, your on call time starts at midnight day 1 of your reserve block, which also starts the 168 clock, so if they never put you in a 30 hr rest you turn into a pumpkin at some point.
My question for clarification is that starts hour 169, because you are considered in rest up until 2359 your last off day, correct?
Also for the first day if you are on shirt call at some point it still starts at midnight day one, you just convert to a different on call status?
Dont bid reserve often, haven’t in a long time, but considering trying to see how the new rules suit me.
My question for clarification is that starts hour 169, because you are considered in rest up until 2359 your last off day, correct?
Also for the first day if you are on shirt call at some point it still starts at midnight day one, you just convert to a different on call status?
Dont bid reserve often, haven’t in a long time, but considering trying to see how the new rules suit me.
If you have no assignment on the first day, then you are a pumpkin on day 7, other than a DH-only duty period. You actually can't report on day 6 past 1800 in order to have proper 30/168 lookback.
If you have an assignment on your first LC day, and you are free of duty up until report, say a 1200 SC, so you are off from 0000-1200, that time from 0000-1200 doesn't count towards your 30/168. Any time you are coming off an X day and due to an assignment you are not on LC starting at 0000 your rest is briefly considered broken right at 0000 in order for you to theoretically check your schedule for an early report assignment and then if you have an assignment you are immediately placed into rest. So that very brief break in rest breaks the 30 hour lookback. So in the end no matter what your 30 hour rest ends at 2359 on your last day before starting LC.
And of course all those times shift if you are not starting LC at 0000 due to a PR day or assigned 30 hour rest period, but the principles remain the same.
09-12-2023, 09:33 AM
#2864
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Mar 2015
Position: stake holder ir.delta.com
Posts: 10,454
This is a scenario where things get a little messy under the new PWA. Swap with the pot can still be processed automatically by PCS for second-day trips, but white slips cannot. After the 0700 PCS run, second-day white slips must be processed manually by scheduling.
When PCS ran at 1200, it denied your white slip because it was for a second-day trip after the 0700 run. It then awarded the swap to the other pilot because swaps are still performed by PCS up until 0700 the day prior.
Had crew scheduling performed the manual coverage process prior to the next PCS run, the trip could have been awarded to you as a white slip. Unfortunately, they’re allowed to wait as long as they want to run coverage.
It’s a screwy scenario, but unfortunately legal under 23.E.2 and 23.N. The only real way to avoid it is to call scheduling after you put the white slip in and ask them if they can run coverage on the trip.
When PCS ran at 1200, it denied your white slip because it was for a second-day trip after the 0700 run. It then awarded the swap to the other pilot because swaps are still performed by PCS up until 0700 the day prior.
Had crew scheduling performed the manual coverage process prior to the next PCS run, the trip could have been awarded to you as a white slip. Unfortunately, they’re allowed to wait as long as they want to run coverage.
It’s a screwy scenario, but unfortunately legal under 23.E.2 and 23.N. The only real way to avoid it is to call scheduling after you put the white slip in and ask them if they can run coverage on the trip.
This is sure to get entertaining now.
09-12-2023, 09:53 AM
#2865
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Jul 2022
Posts: 929
Totally different scenario. Those guys were calling scheduling and asking them to ignore the PWA / coverage ladder and award a trip out of seniority.
The guy who I flew with simply called scheduling and said “Hey, I see a trip that just opened 2 days from now that I’m interested in. Are you going to be starting the coverage process on that soon?” That nudged the scheduler to run coverage and award the trip to the proper pilot according to the coverage ladder.
The guy who I flew with simply called scheduling and said “Hey, I see a trip that just opened 2 days from now that I’m interested in. Are you going to be starting the coverage process on that soon?” That nudged the scheduler to run coverage and award the trip to the proper pilot according to the coverage ladder.
09-12-2023, 10:21 AM
#2866
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Mar 2015
Position: stake holder ir.delta.com
Posts: 10,454
Totally different scenario. Those guys were calling scheduling and asking them to ignore the PWA / coverage ladder and award a trip out of seniority.
The guy who I flew with simply called scheduling and said “Hey, I see a trip that just opened 2 days from now that I’m interested in. Are you going to be starting the coverage process on that soon?” That nudged the scheduler to run coverage and award the trip to the proper pilot according to the coverage ladder.
The guy who I flew with simply called scheduling and said “Hey, I see a trip that just opened 2 days from now that I’m interested in. Are you going to be starting the coverage process on that soon?” That nudged the scheduler to run coverage and award the trip to the proper pilot according to the coverage ladder.
Somebody will always find fault with people contacting CS.
09-12-2023, 11:39 AM
#2867
On Reserve
Joined APC: Mar 2022
Posts: 14
Speaking of calling crew scheduling. Whats the guidance on calling to operate a commute home. Was flying NY to my home and they were missing an FO would it have been verboten to call and be like i'm legal at the gate and willing to fly? I ended up taking a southwest flt that left 15 min after the dl one was scheduled just so I didn't open that can of worms. IDK if the DL flight ever made it, I know when I landed at home it still hadnt left ny.
09-12-2023, 11:54 AM
#2868
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: May 2012
Posts: 1,159
Speaking of calling crew scheduling. Whats the guidance on calling to operate a commute home. Was flying NY to my home and they were missing an FO would it have been verboten to call and be like i'm legal at the gate and willing to fly? I ended up taking a southwest flt that left 15 min after the dl one was scheduled just so I didn't open that can of worms. IDK if the DL flight ever made it, I know when I landed at home it still hadnt left ny.
09-12-2023, 11:58 AM
#2869
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Oct 2017
Posts: 395
Speaking of calling crew scheduling. Whats the guidance on calling to operate a commute home. Was flying NY to my home and they were missing an FO would it have been verboten to call and be like i'm legal at the gate and willing to fly? I ended up taking a southwest flt that left 15 min after the dl one was scheduled just so I didn't open that can of worms. IDK if the DL flight ever made it, I know when I landed at home it still hadnt left ny.
09-12-2023, 12:11 PM
#2870
Rerouted On Weekends
Joined APC: Oct 2015
Position: 717A
Posts: 2,937
Speaking of calling crew scheduling. Whats the guidance on calling to operate a commute home. Was flying NY to my home and they were missing an FO would it have been verboten to call and be like i'm legal at the gate and willing to fly? I ended up taking a southwest flt that left 15 min after the dl one was scheduled just so I didn't open that can of worms. IDK if the DL flight ever made it, I know when I landed at home it still hadnt left ny.
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