beernutt

Jerry, I rarely agree with your posts but I like your style on this.

Alan Chesnutt
SLC 220A

FangsF15

This is unfair. For one thing, we desperately need voices of moderation in society, and also in our union. It is foolish to think otherwise. We don’t need to descend into mob rule. Like many things, the optimum solution usually lies in the middle somewhere.

I’m as critical of the company’s decisions as anyone. But we must understand them if we are to prevail against them. And I’m all for debate and keeping folks honest, but give sailing some slack.

“Know your enemy and know yourself. In 1,000 battles you will never be in peril”. - Sun Tzu

sailingfun

PM’d my name, will be happy to send my phone number if you want to chat.

FangsF15

Yeah, at least…

I don’t support this, but won’t be surprised if this is about what we get. Southwest’s ~10 year wait was similar, I believe. They called it “full retro”, but I believe they actually went in small chunks year-by-year, significantly reducing the “retro”.

The retired and soon-to-be will squeal from the rooftops over it too (not that I blame them, I probably would too)…

JamesBond

This might be playing semantics in a way, but it is not a pay 'cut', but it is definitely not a pay 'raise'. If you insist on that definition, then ever year that our payrate increases exceed inflation has been a pay raise. It's a moving target. We could also argue that whatever the rates are, if work rules are not changed we will have maintained status quo (still not a paycut). I highly doubt that the hourly pay rates will go down so they will at least 'match' the most recent ones. I'm not sure what you are getting at regarding the increasing supply of currency. Are you referring to increasing revenue by DAL? I agree with the prevalent sentiment that we have leverage due to the pilot shortage, but that has been somewhat mitigated by the economic disaster that we are watching unfold. A Biden recession will kill that leverage as John Q won't have enough money to travel no matter how pent up they are. So... if the company can hold out long enough for the economy to really crater, then they will win because they can 'legitimately' cry poor. However... I firmly believe that if the Republicans can take control in November and can somehow reverse all the poor decisions of the last year (and get rid of Fauci and the ChinaFlu fearmongers) that DAL will be printing money at a rate never before seen and they will be FORCED to come to the table with a big check. jmho... ymmv I love the discussion.

gloopy

Yeah this POV leans heavily on the fan fiction of a pre-assumed 1B in value that we could have signed just in the nick of time before the world lost its mind and we'd be riding high. Heck, we could have even used the gov welfare to pay out at those higher rates too! Win-win! Any concessions it would have taken to get that raise would be minor. That's the fantasy world of retroactive, non-falsifiable hypotheticals that we're supposed to automatically assume were presented to us on a silver platter.

Gunfighter

Math
The missed aspect of this inflation talk is the impact of taxes.
8% inflation means something that cost $100 now costs $108. You need a 12% raise on your $100 of earnings to have $8 more take home after taxes. The only way raises equal to inflation becomes neutral is with corresponding increases to the marginal tax rates. If you have a mortgage, congratulations one of your biggest expenses (mortgage interest) is immune from inflation.

Dancing on the edge of politics
Taxes and inflation walk hand in hand within the realm of government fiscal policy. The way you or I can keep pace with inflation is by aligning our financial interests with the government and central banks via long term fixed rate debt on income producing assets. When the income from assets exceeds your cost of living, inflation boosts your spendable income and creates wealth. Getting inflation adjusted pay raises is death by 1,000 cuts from the taxman when the raises are taxed at the highest marginal rate.

JamesBond

You have been spouting this for years. Why do you feel it is so important to have real names on here. Besides, I have known who sailingfun is for at least 10 years. It's just the way this board is set up to be 'anonymous'. Go over to chitchat if names are that important to you.

All in all I'd rather have a like button on here.

JamesBond

That is exceptionally depressing.

gloopy

Yep. Which is why a progressive tax like that is literally the Second Plank of the Communist Manifesto.

It was unconstitutional when the Progs initially tried it, so they got their foot in the door with a Constitutional amendment paired with a sneaky first version of it. It was originally a tiny tax that even the uber rich would pay. The top rate was 6% and that only kicked in for money over 500K a year (about 12M a year in today's dollars). Below that the rate fell off to almost zero for the vast majority of the middle class. Now look where we are.

Inflation is an intentional tax. When paired with a progressive income tax it becomes a powerful transfer of the value of your labor to the government, corporations, and those who vote to keep them in power.

Hence Alexis de Tocqueville's famous quote: “The American Republic will endure until the day Congress discovers that it can bribe the public with the public's money.”