Prepare Yourselves… 2022 AEs

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11-12-2021, 12:00 PM

#131

jaxsurf

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Quote:

Originally Posted by Rinaldi

the problem with base swaps outside of an AE is that they don’t just affect the people who want a swap. If a pilot junior to me swaps bases with a pilot senior to me, it affects my quality of life. Think one number is a small thing? It’s not. Years ago I missed out on a regular line by one number for six straight months. I’ve missed out on green slips by one number many times. Can that same change happen via an AE? Sure. But at least in an AE everyone has a chance to participate. Base swaps outside of an AE should never happen.

So would you also be opposed to monthly AEs, because someone senior to you might bid into your BES, thereby screwing your chances of getting a line or a GS?

11-12-2021, 12:00 PM

#132

Gunfighter

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Quote:

Originally Posted by OOfff

Not true. Someone junior could take a spot with a base transfer from a senior person who requires a vacancy to change equipment.

We're talking about base swaps. One in, one out, same seat/equipment, no training. Filling a vacancy or displacement would still require an AE.

11-12-2021, 12:01 PM

#133

OOfff

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Quote:

Originally Posted by Gunfighter

We're talking base swaps, not transfers. One in, one out. Filling a vacancy or displacement would still require an AE.

the original post said transfers, not swaps. But the same thing would apply if a swap happened junior to someone who wanted a base.

for instance, two 73N pilots, 8500 and 9500, do a swap from Atl to Msp. But a 7500 SEA 7ER pilot wanted MSP73N. That pilot wouldn’t get a crack at MSP, but the 9500 ATL pilot would

11-12-2021, 12:07 PM

#134

Gunfighter

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Quote:

Originally Posted by OOfff

the original post said transfers, not swaps. But the same thing would apply if a swap happened junior to someone who wanted a base

Draw yourself a picture, BES size remains constant. One pilot in, one pilot out. Additional vacancies (or displacements) would still be filled in seniority order, by AE in this hypothetical base swap system.

Swaps would be processed in seniority order not via a P2P swap board. It would be done as a monthly AE with only contingent vacancies and no training requirements.

11-12-2021, 12:08 PM

#135

OOfff

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Quote:

Originally Posted by Gunfighter

see my edit:

for instance, two 73N pilots, 8500 and 9500, do a swap from Atl to Msp. But a 7500 SEA 7ER pilot wanted MSP73N. That pilot wouldn’t get a crack at MSP, but the 9500 ATL pilot would

11-12-2021, 12:32 PM

#136

MitchRapp

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Quote:

Originally Posted by OOfff

see my edit:

for instance, two 73N pilots, 8500 and 9500, do a swap from Atl to Msp. But a 7500 SEA 7ER pilot wanted MSP73N. That pilot wouldn’t get a crack at MSP, but the 9500 ATL pilot would

There's no vacancy for the 7ER pilot to fill.. Maybe SEA7ER should have bid SEA73N and there might have been someone in MSP who wanted SEA.

11-12-2021, 12:37 PM

#137

Herkflyr

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Quote:

Originally Posted by OOfff

see my edit:

for instance, two 73N pilots, 8500 and 9500, do a swap from Atl to Msp. But a 7500 SEA 7ER pilot wanted MSP73N. That pilot wouldn’t get a crack at MSP, but the 9500 ATL pilot would

I haven't really thought about this topic much, but in your example/edit... so what? The hypothetical 7500 SEA 7ER pilot couldn't get MSP 73N regardless, since he would need to go to training via AE or displacement award. If the junior guy (already qualified) moves to MSP, the SEA guy isn't harmed at all, since he is still in SEA regardless of whether base swaps are allowed or not, until an AE is posted.

He'll be senior to either of the hypothetical guys in your example once he converts. How has he been harmed, unless you can prove that base swaps would reduce the number of AEs that would otherwise be posted.

Now if we were talking about a "P2P Swapboard" kind of setup then I think we'd all agree that's unacceptable. We're not...at least I don't think so.

11-12-2021, 12:39 PM

#138

jaxsurf

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lol so oofff’s point is that we should hold everyone hostage from being able to easily trade bases just because some pilot in a totally different BES is mad about someone else in a totally different BES swapping bases that they want?

Maybe the 7ER pilot should have bid for MSP73N on an AE if they wanted it so bad.

11-12-2021, 12:41 PM

#139

OOfff

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Quote:

Originally Posted by Herkflyr

“once he/she converts” is the problem. It wouldn’t ever happen if the vacancy is filled by a junior person. That pilot’s transfer out is filled by a junior pilot, rather than the senior one. So no vacancy shows up on the AE. However, under our current system, MSP transfers to ATL and SEA moves to MSP. Junior ATL is left out

11-12-2021, 12:42 PM

#140

OOfff

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Quote:

Originally Posted by jaxsurf

my point is that by having base trades, those vacancies may not even get processed on an AE. So there’s not a spot for SEA7ER to bid into…because it went to a junior pilot.