New Hire Class Drops
06-07-2023, 09:54 AM
#4391
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Apr 2008
Position: DAL FO
Posts: 2,169
LOL best designed. It's not predictable you littery have a 33% chance at briefing the correct runway. The published arrivals state the exact wrong runway as the default. You are better off not guessing and reacting to the actual assignment and occasionally that gets changed too. The design of the airport may be good but the use of it to serve the pilots, which is the ATC customer base, is terrible. Down to the refusing to use the new loop and the M2 BS. DEN is a much better design.
But why LC going the other way? Why not full length?
06-07-2023, 10:00 AM
#4392
Roll’n Thunder
Joined APC: Oct 2009
Position: Pilot
Posts: 3,836
Just a guess, but it's gotta be easier when you've got a plane with a flow time or numbers issue or whatever else that they need a few minutes before being ready to just have them roll long to LA instead of everyone planning on LA then needing to use LC because the plane is sitting at LA, or the plane holds at LC and everyone has to taxi around them to get to LA.
06-07-2023, 10:04 AM
#4393
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Sep 2014
Posts: 891
LOL best designed. It's not predictable you littery have a 33% chance at briefing the correct runway. The published arrivals state the exact wrong runway as the default. You are better off not guessing and reacting to the actual assignment and occasionally that gets changed too. The design of the airport may be good but the use of it to serve the pilots, which is the ATC customer base, is terrible. Down to the refusing to use the new loop and the M2 BS. DEN is a much better design.
compared to somewhere like Charlotte or Ohare it’s way simpler and less confusing.
kennedy has been a nightmare getting in and out of terminal 4 recently and has a way higher chance of a taxi/runway violation imho.
I guess a lot of it depends on what you’re used to/familiar with.
06-07-2023, 10:11 AM
#4394
Leaves Biscoff crumbs
Joined APC: Jan 2020
Position: Blue Juice Taste Tester
Posts: 1,363
LOL best designed. It's not predictable you littery have a 33% chance at briefing the correct runway. The published arrivals state the exact wrong runway as the default. You are better off not guessing and reacting to the actual assignment and occasionally that gets changed too. The design of the airport may be good but the use of it to serve the pilots, which is the ATC customer base, is terrible. Down to the refusing to use the new loop and the M2 BS. DEN is a much better design.
06-07-2023, 10:33 AM
#4395
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Sep 2013
Position: On the hotel shuttle
Posts: 5,907
Atlantisms:
"Taxi to 26L via F." Okay, that only gets me halfway there.
"Cleared for takeoff 27R."
"Cleared for takeoff 27R intersection LC."
"No, I cleared you for takeoff from 27R."
"Okay, but we were told to taxi to 27R-LC. We're not full length, this is intersection LC."
"You don't fly here very often do you?"
"Standard taxi 27R."
"Isn't '27R M, J, L, LC' about the same number of syllables while not requiring us researching while we taxi?"
"Taxi to 26L via F." Okay, that only gets me halfway there.
"Cleared for takeoff 27R."
"Cleared for takeoff 27R intersection LC."
"No, I cleared you for takeoff from 27R."
"Okay, but we were told to taxi to 27R-LC. We're not full length, this is intersection LC."
"You don't fly here very often do you?"
"Standard taxi 27R."
"Isn't '27R M, J, L, LC' about the same number of syllables while not requiring us researching while we taxi?"
06-07-2023, 10:52 AM
#4396
Roll’n Thunder
Joined APC: Oct 2009
Position: Pilot
Posts: 3,836
Atlantisms:
"Taxi to 26L via F." Okay, that only gets me halfway there.
"Cleared for takeoff 27R."
"Cleared for takeoff 27R intersection LC."
"No, I cleared you for takeoff from 27R."
"Okay, but we were told to taxi to 27R-LC. We're not full length, this is intersection LC."
"You don't fly here very often do you?"
"Standard taxi 27R."
"Isn't '27R M, J, L, LC' about the same number of syllables while not requiring us researching while we taxi?"
"Taxi to 26L via F." Okay, that only gets me halfway there.
"Cleared for takeoff 27R."
"Cleared for takeoff 27R intersection LC."
"No, I cleared you for takeoff from 27R."
"Okay, but we were told to taxi to 27R-LC. We're not full length, this is intersection LC."
"You don't fly here very often do you?"
"Standard taxi 27R."
"Isn't '27R M, J, L, LC' about the same number of syllables while not requiring us researching while we taxi?"
You don't fly here very often, do you?
06-07-2023, 12:19 PM
#4397
Moderator
Joined APC: Sep 2011
Posts: 4,812
LOL best designed. It's not predictable you littery have a 33% chance at briefing the correct runway. The published arrivals state the exact wrong runway as the default. You are better off not guessing and reacting to the actual assignment and occasionally that gets changed too. The design of the airport may be good but the use of it to serve the pilots, which is the ATC customer base, is terrible. Down to the refusing to use the new loop and the M2 BS. DEN is a much better design.
But whatever, it's a silly thing to argue over. It's super efficient. And the busiest airport in the world (most years), and it runs like a finely tuned machine the vast, vast majority of the time. It's just not hard.
I'm sure everyone can agree, however, that Chicago (really any United hub) is freaking terrible to get in and out of.
06-07-2023, 12:25 PM
#4398
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Mar 2015
Position: stake holder ir.delta.com
Posts: 10,456
DEN the arrival is mated with the runway. When it changes, it all changes in one stroke well prior to the arrival controller reaching blindfolded into the bag of runways. There's no guessing just reacting. I hate ATL for a myriad of reasons including no heading requests on departure to give yourself the requisite 5 mile spacing from weather. What "extenda" marvels at is the fact that 90% of the time they get 10lbs of sh!t to fit in the 5lbs bag. But when all their stuffing explodes the bag, sh!t goes everywhere. Then pilots are blamed and have to cleanup the sh!t. No buffers is the problem not the solution.
06-07-2023, 02:24 PM
#4400
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Jul 2022
Posts: 930
ATL is the best designed airport in the world, bar none. Ain't even close. Which makes it predicable. And easy. I genuinely don't get the angst.
However, if the argument is that touching ATL makes you more susceptible to a reroute, I might concede that point. But with the new reroute rules starting 1 Aug, I'm actually okay with that.
However, if the argument is that touching ATL makes you more susceptible to a reroute, I might concede that point. But with the new reroute rules starting 1 Aug, I'm actually okay with that.
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