Originally Posted by FL370esq

Not sure that is the issue. No matter how senior you are, even the #1 pilot on the seniority list cannot AE into a category without a posted vacancy. Reinstatements come in to play when the Company has prematurely displaced a pilot from a category then decides it needs to add that position back (within a defined period of time). In essence, there is no vacancy to be had for the senior AE pilot because that "vacancy" was actually created by an over-displacement. But for the MD, there would not have been a vacancy for the senior pilot to bid on.

Normally, I would agree that the contract worked as advertised but I think this AE is unlike any other we have had...in the last 20 years anyway. We had a MOAD which closed numerous categories and things fell out as they would under the terms of our PWA. Then, after the MOAD was published, the Company provided a program to incentivize pilots to leave...and 1,800 will do so. Now the Company is publishing an AE to fill many of those VEOP vacancies which will result in reinstatements for many pilots. If the Company had run the VEOP prior to the MOAD, this issue would be less exacerbated as those vacancies would have subsequently been factored in to the MOAD.

In the end, those senior pilots who displaced from closed categories got what they "wanted" for a displacement bid and the uber-junior pilots got what they could hold. A re-bid won't change their results. However, there is a demographic that likely could have gone somewhere more senior had the current "vacancies" been factored in. The issue becomes how would you do that and I don't think Delta technology has the power to address that issue. Do you put everyone back into their pre-MOAD position and re-run their final May preferences with the current vacancies factored in? MDs are supposed to convert from the bottom (except for those who checked the "convert before" box) so, in theory, those already converted were going to their new category anyway and those who AE'd went where they wanted so they aren't an issue.

Overall....this is a mess brought on by JL, RG and BS. Unfortunately, I think this mess is one that we are stuck with.

Originally Posted by GogglesPisano

Can reinstatement rights be used on a backfill? The PWA just states "posted vacancy."

Originally Posted by Gen6

The issue of active in category and converted still remains. Some people are arguing that an unconverted pilot reinstating converted on the award date blocking the senior pilot on an MD from being awarded that position on the MOAD. This allegedly clears up the contractual right of the senior pilot not being awarded the junior pilots position since both were displaced. Now the AE comes and the junior pilot was actually active and bidding his category the whole time and some are saying he was converted on the day of the award. Fast forward to reinstatement rights being 6 bid periods after being converted and people are saying that starts after you actually convert and start being paid and bidding in the new category. In other words a junior pilot who we will say converts for bidding and pay in Feb 2021 has reinstatement rights through July 2021 but for not being displaced on the MOAD he was considered converted on the day of the award. That is a massive contradiction and clearly not addressed. It's one or the other.

Originally Posted by Gone Flying

I thought UNAs didn’t have reinstatement rights? Most jr non UNA is 10410 next month.

but yeah I see what you are saying

Originally Posted by Xray678

yeah I’m probably a little off on the number. But....I think you will be surprised at how junior it goes do to reinst

Originally Posted by captkdobbs

I got HOSED on the MOAD (that should be a T-shirt; thanks Plaintrain.) as well! I have no category to be reinstated.

I don't like the fact that junior guys will most likely get reinstated to categories that I'm bidding, but I'd rather take the hit now (and hold onto my anger at management for the s@r3w job) knowing that the current contract language was adhered to.

My question for future (current) section 6 negotiations is can/should the language be modified? How can we protect future pilots from the current machinations/manipulations by management?

Originally Posted by Hillbilly

I think it would require additional language to be added under reinstatement rights indicating a different treatment if a pilot's MD were the result of a category closure. Maybe allow them to act as a MD for any bid that closes within the first 33% of the conversion window of the original displacement? 121 days after the initial MD for a 365 bid or 70 days after the original MD for a 210 bid. Something along those lines might address the issue. Regardless, it would take a contractual change to accomplish. That ship has sailed for current bid.

Originally Posted by captkdobbs

Interesting concept. I like it. The % of conversion window would keep it from being a 'catch all'.

One of the things we see in the current bid is the fact that there is a high likelihood that reinstatements MAY save many training events that the company couldn't have accomplished in the 365 days anyway.

Having language like that would prevent the company from deciding to randomly flush a couple of categories and then, before the dust even settles (like now) post an AE rebuilding the desired category using reinstatements of junior pilots while locking senior pilots into their MD positions. Chess at its finest.

I agree that that ship has sailed for this bid, but I like the concept.