Any Former Southwest, now Happy Delta Pilots?
11-29-2018, 05:36 PM
#71
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Joined APC: Dec 2007
Posts: 59
Something to consider as well is size of the pilot lists. DL has 14.5k right now, and it will surely grow in time. Perhaps slowly with our upgauging strategy. We’re on pace to hire 1k annually, with +-7k retirements the next 10 years. You’ll probably be at 50% seniority by then.
At SWA what’s the size, nearly 9k? I know hiring there has been something like 600-800 pilots annually. I hear your sim building is expanding, maybe room for future continued future growth. Wild card if SW ever goes longhaul. The retirement big wave will be delayed for years, but will happen. I think there was something like <50 guys under 30yrs old on property (avg older new hires), so you would likely retire at a higher %, especially since you already have 2 years in. To get to 50% in 8 years, you’d need what, 3k-4K retirements based off the growth?
I’m guessing system seniority movement is pretty similar. I’d guess upgrade on 737 at ATL would be faster at DL, since it’s generally Sr at SW. You’d have a great variety of options in general in ATL (HQ/SIM, small NB Jr planes, big NB, WB, etc).
At SWA what’s the size, nearly 9k? I know hiring there has been something like 600-800 pilots annually. I hear your sim building is expanding, maybe room for future continued future growth. Wild card if SW ever goes longhaul. The retirement big wave will be delayed for years, but will happen. I think there was something like <50 guys under 30yrs old on property (avg older new hires), so you would likely retire at a higher %, especially since you already have 2 years in. To get to 50% in 8 years, you’d need what, 3k-4K retirements based off the growth?
I’m guessing system seniority movement is pretty similar. I’d guess upgrade on 737 at ATL would be faster at DL, since it’s generally Sr at SW. You’d have a great variety of options in general in ATL (HQ/SIM, small NB Jr planes, big NB, WB, etc).
SWA has 9800 pilots on
11-29-2018, 06:18 PM
#72
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Dec 2006
Position: 737 FO
Posts: 2,370
Currently most new hires are going to Atlanta, even with the MD-88 going away I'd expect ATL pretty quickly, especially if able to hold 73N or likely A320 in initial (and that's if you didn't get an ATL slot then). NYC is junior all over while ATL is senior for top end but junior to hold as a base. Right now all bases seem to be attainable in a year but that would apply to those who started a year ago. While past performance does not guarantee future success I expect that trend to continue.
11-29-2018, 06:26 PM
#73
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Joined APC: Apr 2016
Position: Looking left
Posts: 3,378
Nope...the 757/767 (200 and 300’s) make up our ER category....we also have a separate 767-400 category that pays roughly $20 more per our then the ER.
11-29-2018, 06:30 PM
#74
Roll’n Thunder
Joined APC: Oct 2009
Position: Pilot
Posts: 3,836
Our ALPA website shows your relative seniority each year until you retire based on forecast retirements. From that the best you can do is extrapolate at what age you could hold a base/seat based on today’s seniority distribution. Anything past 5 years projecting ahead is pretty much a crap shoot because no one knows how things will play out regarding aircraft basing, fleet size, staffing levels, economic conditions, etc. But at least the tool will give you a general picture of the future.
11-29-2018, 07:28 PM
#75
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Joined APC: Sep 2015
Posts: 631
The number 1 ATL737A has a seniority number under 50. The first 3 pages (top 10%0 could all be senior WB captains in ATL. 50% of ATL737A is still able to hold WB Captain (765/330 and above). The first few pages of guys pretty much only do 10 days worth of day turns.
The senior guys in my WB category could be WB Captains. Pick your schedule and probably make about as much as a WB Captain w/o much extra effort...not a bad gig if you can get.
The senior guys in my WB category could be WB Captains. Pick your schedule and probably make about as much as a WB Captain w/o much extra effort...not a bad gig if you can get.
11-29-2018, 10:18 PM
#76
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Joined APC: Dec 2012
Position: Supreme Allied Commander
Posts: 1,074
Retirements are about half of what DL is going to have. In my math, in the next ten years, I will witness 3000 retirements at SWA (yes Delta has a lot more) plus their growing, currently hiring 600-700 a year...at their growth of 0%-3%, my seniority at retirement will be 14-8%. So definitely top ten percent. Upgrades will be coming down a little bit from the 10yrs to something like around 7-8yrs. This is my math plugged into seniority projections. Delta has better 50% seniority gain in next ten years. Does this clarify my situation?
11-29-2018, 10:20 PM
#77
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Joined APC: Jan 2017
Posts: 156
Be happy were you are at. Stop asking yourself the "what if" question. Retirements look good now but things can and will change in this industry. Numbers behind you are the best protection. Everyone thinks the good times never end till they do. Enjoy life and dont compare w2s it will drive you crazy.
11-30-2018, 05:28 AM
#78
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Joined APC: May 2015
Position: A350 Both
Posts: 7,292
I think that is a bit shortsighted, but I get where you are coming from. Disclaimer: I'm a homer. I wouldn't go to LUV as the number one captain with a 50% pay increase every year. I have 5000 hours in up and down 737 flying and that was enough. Personally I wouldn't want to do that for 25 years. But that is just me. There are lots of pilots out there that don't like international, and LUV has homers too. But at Delta at least you have the choice. If pay is everything, then it would seem you have made your decision, but are looking for confirmation.
11-30-2018, 05:35 AM
#79
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Joined APC: May 2015
Position: A350 Both
Posts: 7,292
If you're happy where you are, and think the work lifestyle of SW is something you can be happy with indefinitely (no intl WB lifestyle desire), I might just stay. You got your base, you'd take 5 years to makeup the paycut. You'd make very similar pay on a year per year basis as a FO or CA if you flew NB DL, which most people do the majority of their career. Long term you "may" never get to be a WB CA in ATL. I'm showing mid 40s guy, 2039 retirement would be 20-25% range. Obviously single pilot flying robot cars and the like make 20 year forecasts guesswork. Either choice is a happy and successful career. Good luck.
11-30-2018, 05:38 AM
#80
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Joined APC: Sep 2014
Posts: 4,994
I fully expect my tastes in flying to change over the course of my life and career. Aging kids, different hobbies,
grandkids, etc could drive that...as could simply getting bored. Having the ability to change things up mid-stream (nb to wb and back) would be worth an overall compensation sacrifice for me.
grandkids, etc could drive that...as could simply getting bored. Having the ability to change things up mid-stream (nb to wb and back) would be worth an overall compensation sacrifice for me.
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